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> In the interview you quoted, the word "dangerous" is used once: If you're familiar with the situation, you know that homeless frequently talk about the dange

by bnralt 4y ago

> In the interview you quoted, the word "dangerous" is used once: If you're familiar with the situation, you know that homeless frequently talk about the dangerous nature of shelters as a reason why they don't want to stay there. I hope that any discussion about the issue would at least be aware of that. The article I picked was just the first one that come up on Google in case people were new to the situation and didn't know much about it, but there are plenty of others you can find with even a quick search: > Likewise, respondents said they found it hard to coexist with others battling mental health issues at the shelters and that it sometimes led to issues such as fights, which made others feel unsafe.[1]. ** > But shelter beds seldom keep pace with need. And some people, like Carver, avoid shelters even when they are available. They say they feel unsafe and uncomfortable in the shelters, or they impose rules they can’t follow.[2] ** > They refuse to go back because they feel unsafe in them. Whether due to mere paranoia caused by an individual's unfortunate battle with mental illness or is a legitimate take on the reality of the conditions within the homeless shelter itself, the feeling of unsafety is as real as it gets. Some individuals site witnessing violence, drug solicitation, or theft as reasons it is unsafe to stay.[3] __________________ > And you'll note, I'm not actually saying we put them in apartments right next to pre-existing tenants. That's the way it is being implemented cities trying the "housing first" approach, though, and with predictable results (long time residents having to move as there's a sharp increase in crime and violence in the building). [1] https://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/news/local/des-moines/2023/01/18/des-moines-homeless-iowa-shelters-study-housing-solutions/69814146007/ https://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/news/local/des-moine... [2] https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/nov/02/unhoused-people-shelters-homelessness-to-jail-cycle https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/nov/02/unhoused-peo... [3] https://caufsociety.com/why-the-homeless-refuse-help/ https://caufsociety.com/why-the-homeless-refuse-help/

kerkeslager 4y ago
> If you're familiar with the situation, you know that homeless frequently talk about the dangerous nature of shelters as a reason why they don't want to stay there. If you're familiar with the post you're responding to, you know that I didn't disagree with that. How many times are you going to continue accusing me of this straw man argument? I've already told you that's not what I'm disagreeing with. You go on to quote a bunch of support for my assertion that shelters aren't homes. People herded into warehouses like cattle and forced into close proximity with no privacy get into fights? Why is that surprising to anyone? > > And you'll note, I'm not actually saying we put them in apartments right next to pre-existing tenants. > That's the way it is being implemented cities trying the "housing first" approach, though, and with predictable results (long time residents having to move as there's a sharp increase in crime and violence in the building). There are a bunch of reasons why that's happening: among them a refusal to re-purpose office and retail spaces which would be farther from existing residential areas, and intentional poor implementations of these programs by political interests so they can say they don't work. Failures of a poor implementation vaguely related to what I'm actually suggesting, aren't actually criticisms of my suggestion.

by bnralt 4y ago

kerkeslager 4y ago

> If you're familiar with the situation, you know that homeless frequently talk about the dangerous nature of shelters as a reason why they don't want to stay there. If you're familiar with the post you're responding to, you know that I didn't disagree with that. How many times are you going to continue accusing me of this straw man argument? I've already told you that's not what I'm disagreeing with. You go on to quote a bunch of support for my assertion that shelters aren't homes. People herded into warehouses like cattle and forced into close proximity with no privacy get into fights? Why is that surprising to anyone? > > And you'll note, I'm not actually saying we put them in apartments right next to pre-existing tenants. > That's the way it is being implemented cities trying the "housing first" approach, though, and with predictable results (long time residents having to move as there's a sharp increase in crime and violence in the building). There are a bunch of reasons why that's happening: among them a refusal to re-purpose office and retail spaces which would be farther from existing residential areas, and intentional poor implementations of these programs by political interests so they can say they don't work. Failures of a poor implementation vaguely related to what I'm actually suggesting, aren't actually criticisms of my suggestion.