2 ms·

>If you actually believe something is true, trying to compel people to believe it is a very counter-productive measure, because it doesn't convince people to be

>If you actually believe something is true, trying to compel people to believe it is a very counter-productive measure, because it doesn't convince people to believe it – they may outwardly pretend to believe, but inwardly they'll rebel against the compulsion This isn't the case at scale, people are more likely to believe something if it is normalized for them. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asch_conformity_experiments https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asch_conformity_experiments

skissane 4y ago
> This isn't the case at scale, people are more likely to believe something if it is normalized for them. How then do you explain the case of Iran I cited? Islam enforced as the state religion, leaving it is punishable with death (at least in theory), and yet there has been a huge decline in Islamic belief over the last few decades. That's evidence against your position. > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asch_conformity_experiments https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asch_conformity_experiments In those experiments, only a minority of test subjects adjusted their expressed belief in response to social pressure; and only a minority of that minority appeared inwardly convinced in doing so. So this experiment doesn't support your position – putting aside the question of whether a highly contrived experiment is actually generalisable to ordinary human social behaviour.
- antibasilisk 4y ago
  >How then do you explain the case of Iran I cited? Islam enforced as the state religion, leaving it is punishable with death (at least in theory), and yet there has been a huge decline in Islamic belief over the last few decades. That's evidence against your position. 'more likely' isn't the same as 'nobody leaves'. If you compare similar statistics between secular countries and conservative ones, it's quite clear that more people remain religious in the conservative countries. >In those experiments, only a minority of test subjects adjusted their expressed belief in response to social pressure It doesn't have to be a majority.

skissane 4y ago

> This isn't the case at scale, people are more likely to believe something if it is normalized for them. How then do you explain the case of Iran I cited? Islam enforced as the state religion, leaving it is punishable with death (at least in theory), and yet there has been a huge decline in Islamic belief over the last few decades. That's evidence against your position. > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asch_conformity_experiments https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asch_conformity_experiments In those experiments, only a minority of test subjects adjusted their expressed belief in response to social pressure; and only a minority of that minority appeared inwardly convinced in doing so. So this experiment doesn't support your position – putting aside the question of whether a highly contrived experiment is actually generalisable to ordinary human social behaviour.

antibasilisk 4y ago
>How then do you explain the case of Iran I cited? Islam enforced as the state religion, leaving it is punishable with death (at least in theory), and yet there has been a huge decline in Islamic belief over the last few decades. That's evidence against your position. 'more likely' isn't the same as 'nobody leaves'. If you compare similar statistics between secular countries and conservative ones, it's quite clear that more people remain religious in the conservative countries. >In those experiments, only a minority of test subjects adjusted their expressed belief in response to social pressure It doesn't have to be a majority.