4 ms·

Yeah sure, that's why countries which take a hard stance with actual enforcement like the UAE have no open drug markets. The problem is enforcement, as long as

Yeah sure, that's why countries which take a hard stance with actual enforcement like the UAE have no open drug markets. The problem is enforcement, as long as there are open drug markets, then the issue isnt the laws its the joke of a police that pretends to do anything, or rather idiots trying to sympathies with drug users and dealers keeping the police from doing their work.

arcticbull 4y ago
And yet, that's the approach that has completely failed. I suggest you allow data to drive the discussion instead of silly failed moralizations. As a peer comment pointed out, Japan's drug policy is the most strict in the developed world - and it has a massive under-reported meth problem. I suspect the Emirates is similar and lower headline numbers come from lack of reporting - not lack of issues. Do you have some evidence to suggest your approach works? To my knowledge there really isn't any. Maybe it's time to start sympathizing with the drug users if you want to get rid of shady dealers and narcos. We've tried it your way. It sucks.
- jacooper 4y ago
  Not seeing addicts and semi-zombies on the streets is enough.
  - arcticbull 4y ago
    Ah pretending. Got it. It does tend to be easier to live in a world of one's own imagination than to solve the real, hard problems we face. You know where else doesn't have those things? Portugal.
    - jacooper 4y ago
      Hmmm, and is it a normal part of an average person life to ever have taken drugs or got addicted? If so that still counts as a failure, nobody should be allowed to ever take these drugs in their lifetime.
      - arcticbull 4y ago
        But your proposal doesn't stop that. It criminalizes them telling anyone and sweeps it under the rug like you cleaning your room at 11 years old.
      - w3454 4y ago
        [dead]
- jacooper 4y ago
  And to be clear I don't have a problem with helping drug addicts leave drugs, the difference is they should never be allowed to be left using them without any intervention. So the police gets them, and gets the dealer then they either get treated or prisoned depending if its their first time or they are actually addicted.
  - arcticbull 4y ago
    Addiction is a mental and physical health issue. Why on earth are the police involved in the first place? That's not what they're for. But a lot of what you're describing is literally the Portuguese model, which you can find out if you read the article. They can require you go to rehab depending on if it's your first time or if you're addicted. It's just not a criminal matter, it's a public health matter. Which means you have less stigma, you avoid prison, a record - and you are more likely to ask for help. We know for a fact prison is a place you can get drugs, and going there leaves you more likely to be addicted, not less, because you look to those same drugs as an escape from your prison situation.
    - jacooper 4y ago
      > Addiction is a mental and physical health issue. Why on earth are the police involved in the first place? That's not what they're for. The police is going to be the first one to interact with addicts because they should be working on dismantling the entire drug network and working on catching dealers, through catching addicts/buyers.
      - arcticbull 4y ago
        > 5he police is going to be the first one to interact with addicts because they should be working on dismantling the entire drug network and working on catching dealers. Dealers aren't users or addicts. Different people. The police would not be the first to respond to them in 99% of cases. And you can dismantle the network by making it uncompetitive. Let the state sell drugs, who cares? Then the narcos die off and the network dismantles itself.

arcticbull 4y ago

And yet, that's the approach that has completely failed. I suggest you allow data to drive the discussion instead of silly failed moralizations. As a peer comment pointed out, Japan's drug policy is the most strict in the developed world - and it has a massive under-reported meth problem. I suspect the Emirates is similar and lower headline numbers come from lack of reporting - not lack of issues. Do you have some evidence to suggest your approach works? To my knowledge there really isn't any. Maybe it's time to start sympathizing with the drug users if you want to get rid of shady dealers and narcos. We've tried it your way. It sucks.

jacooper 4y ago
Not seeing addicts and semi-zombies on the streets is enough.
- arcticbull 4y ago
  Ah pretending. Got it. It does tend to be easier to live in a world of one's own imagination than to solve the real, hard problems we face. You know where else doesn't have those things? Portugal.
  - jacooper 4y ago
    Hmmm, and is it a normal part of an average person life to ever have taken drugs or got addicted? If so that still counts as a failure, nobody should be allowed to ever take these drugs in their lifetime.
    - arcticbull 4y ago
      But your proposal doesn't stop that. It criminalizes them telling anyone and sweeps it under the rug like you cleaning your room at 11 years old.
    - w3454 4y ago
      [dead]
jacooper 4y ago
And to be clear I don't have a problem with helping drug addicts leave drugs, the difference is they should never be allowed to be left using them without any intervention. So the police gets them, and gets the dealer then they either get treated or prisoned depending if its their first time or they are actually addicted.
- arcticbull 4y ago
  Addiction is a mental and physical health issue. Why on earth are the police involved in the first place? That's not what they're for. But a lot of what you're describing is literally the Portuguese model, which you can find out if you read the article. They can require you go to rehab depending on if it's your first time or if you're addicted. It's just not a criminal matter, it's a public health matter. Which means you have less stigma, you avoid prison, a record - and you are more likely to ask for help. We know for a fact prison is a place you can get drugs, and going there leaves you more likely to be addicted, not less, because you look to those same drugs as an escape from your prison situation.
  - jacooper 4y ago
    > Addiction is a mental and physical health issue. Why on earth are the police involved in the first place? That's not what they're for. The police is going to be the first one to interact with addicts because they should be working on dismantling the entire drug network and working on catching dealers, through catching addicts/buyers.
    - arcticbull 4y ago
      > 5he police is going to be the first one to interact with addicts because they should be working on dismantling the entire drug network and working on catching dealers. Dealers aren't users or addicts. Different people. The police would not be the first to respond to them in 99% of cases. And you can dismantle the network by making it uncompetitive. Let the state sell drugs, who cares? Then the narcos die off and the network dismantles itself.