5 ms·

France seems to be in a sweet spot: low electricity price and low CO2 emissions, thanks to nuclear power?

not_the_fda 4y ago
Yes, France gets 70% of its electricity form nuclear power.
pyrale 4y ago
Thanks to that indeed, but the future doesn't look great, as little has been done in the last 20 years. So France will have to do a lot in the next decade, and that may change our prices.
slashdev 4y ago
There's a important lesson about using nuclear power as an energy source in there. Contrast that with Germany which is shuttering their nuclear power plants in favor of renewables.
- pydry 4y ago
  There is no such lesson. EDF is going bankrupt, France is spending billions trying to replace reactors aging out and about 20% or so of the ~70 billion decommissioning costs are funded. The important lesson here should be that retail prices != prices.
  - eloff 4y ago
    I stand corrected!
- uecker 4y ago
  See my comment to parent. There is an important lesson about not being misled by looking at the wrong data.
uecker 4y ago
Household prices are meaningless in this context, because they are artificially kept low in France and sometimes are affected by taxes and fees elsewhere. Here are spot marked prices: https://tradingeconomics.com/france/electricity-price https://tradingeconomics.com/france/electricity-price https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/electricity-price https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/electricity-price
- tyingq 4y ago
  Interesting. In many states in the US, cost per Kw/H is lower for businesses, even very small ones, than for residences.
  - p1mrx 4y ago
    Kw/H -> kWh It really is quite impressive to write a 3-letter unit with 4 errors.
    - tyingq 4y ago
      And yet, you seem to have figured it out.
      - concordDance 4y ago
        No, he's right. You want Joules. kW is Joules per second, dividing by hours gives Joules per second per second.
    - helloooooooo 4y ago
      well aktchually…
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- belorn 4y ago
  The true comparison require a lot of data and work. One would have to first calculate how much subsidies that each government spend on energy production, how much tax money is spent on grid stability, how much the taxes are, how high the fee is for grid connection, and how much easy producer take. Spot market prices is just whatever the price is in EU, since all the grids are connected and every country in EU must trade if they have surplus energy. It represent the collective supply and demand within EU.
karussell 4y ago
Sweet spot of a mess I guess: half of the 56 nuclear plants were offline (and some still are) due to maintenance or too warm cooling water in Summer. https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/03/edf-to-reduce-nuclear-power-output-as-french-river-temperatures-rise https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/03/edf-to-redu...
- bboygravity 4y ago
  Forgot to do maintenance in France so now all nuclear is bad?
  - Kuinox 4y ago
    Pushed back due to covid.
- gtirloni 4y ago
  So even with half of the 56 nuclear plants offline, they're still ahead. Impressive.

Yes, France gets 70% of its electricity form nuclear power.

Thanks to that indeed, but the future doesn't look great, as little has been done in the last 20 years. So France will have to do a lot in the next decade, and that may change our prices.

slashdev 4y ago

There's a important lesson about using nuclear power as an energy source in there. Contrast that with Germany which is shuttering their nuclear power plants in favor of renewables.

pydry 4y ago
There is no such lesson. EDF is going bankrupt, France is spending billions trying to replace reactors aging out and about 20% or so of the ~70 billion decommissioning costs are funded. The important lesson here should be that retail prices != prices.
- eloff 4y ago
  I stand corrected!
uecker 4y ago
See my comment to parent. There is an important lesson about not being misled by looking at the wrong data.

uecker 4y ago

Household prices are meaningless in this context, because they are artificially kept low in France and sometimes are affected by taxes and fees elsewhere. Here are spot marked prices: https://tradingeconomics.com/france/electricity-price https://tradingeconomics.com/france/electricity-price https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/electricity-price https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/electricity-price

tyingq 4y ago
Interesting. In many states in the US, cost per Kw/H is lower for businesses, even very small ones, than for residences.
- p1mrx 4y ago
  Kw/H -> kWh It really is quite impressive to write a 3-letter unit with 4 errors.
  - tyingq 4y ago
    And yet, you seem to have figured it out.
    - concordDance 4y ago
      No, he's right. You want Joules. kW is Joules per second, dividing by hours gives Joules per second per second.
  - helloooooooo 4y ago
    well aktchually…
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
belorn 4y ago
The true comparison require a lot of data and work. One would have to first calculate how much subsidies that each government spend on energy production, how much tax money is spent on grid stability, how much the taxes are, how high the fee is for grid connection, and how much easy producer take. Spot market prices is just whatever the price is in EU, since all the grids are connected and every country in EU must trade if they have surplus energy. It represent the collective supply and demand within EU.

karussell 4y ago

Sweet spot of a mess I guess: half of the 56 nuclear plants were offline (and some still are) due to maintenance or too warm cooling water in Summer. https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/03/edf-to-reduce-nuclear-power-output-as-french-river-temperatures-rise https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/03/edf-to-redu...

bboygravity 4y ago
Forgot to do maintenance in France so now all nuclear is bad?
- Kuinox 4y ago
  Pushed back due to covid.
gtirloni 4y ago
So even with half of the 56 nuclear plants offline, they're still ahead. Impressive.