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It’s not debatable. Those who attract the best students will be considered top, of course provided they have the resources to give the students. What’s legacy

It’s not debatable. Those who attract the best students will be considered top, of course provided they have the resources to give the students. What’s legacy admissions got to do with it? If 30% of students are legacy and 60% are the best in the world, the 60% will carry the school. You can say the same about affirmative action. Nobody believes colleges produce the best from nothing. They produce good results by starting on third base (great students) and letting them run as fast as they can. Some of those will become the best. That’s how it works.

manuelabeledo 4y ago
> Those who attract the best students will be considered top Universities are not ranked like that, at all. Top universities don't necessarily have the best students, they have the best academics. Harvard could take the dumbest students and still be ranked top 10. > What’s legacy admissions got to do with it? If 30% of students are legacy and 60% are the best in the world, the 60% will carry the school. You assume that there is a 60% of absolutely brilliant students, but there is no proof of that.
- hgsgm 4y ago
  > Top universities don't necessarily have the best students, they have the best academics. What on earth are you trying to say? We are talking about school rankings, not professional researcher rankings. Have you met any brilliant people? Ask them for their opinion. The proof is in their grades, test scores, competition scores, PhD theses and papers, and later work output.
  - manuelabeledo 4y ago
    > We are talking about school rankings, not professional researcher rankings That's how university rankings work. This is widely known stuff. If you think that Stanford is up there because they have brilliant students, you are objectively wrong. In fact, there is no standardized way of comparing students of two different institutions other than research work and citations, which makes them, again, part of the academic body.
    - sokoloff 4y ago
      There are literally standardized tests used in admissions. Looking at the averages of those standardized test scores of Stanford students vs other schools will tell a story about the student body that does not come as a surprise to most of us.
      - manuelabeledo 4y ago
        "Stanford is committed to a holistic review of all candidates. We consider the vast array of information provided in and with each student’s application, whether that information includes test scores or not. Students may continue to self-report test scores in their application if they would like. Applications without test scores will not be at a disadvantage." [0] This paints a very different story. Also, the fact that there is a percentage reserved for legacy admissions, invalidates your point completely. [0] https://admission.stanford.edu https://admission.stanford.edu
        sokoloff 4y ago
        > invalidates your point completely Do you think that Stanford's legacy admission policy makes their student body indistinguishable from that of Pasadena City College? Or that no standardized scoring system would reveal any population-wide differences in academic ability between a school which admits 1 of 25 applicants from another that admits 25 of 25 applicants? Hell, admissions rate alone is probably enough to tell a pretty good part of the story.

manuelabeledo 4y ago

> Those who attract the best students will be considered top Universities are not ranked like that, at all. Top universities don't necessarily have the best students, they have the best academics. Harvard could take the dumbest students and still be ranked top 10. > What’s legacy admissions got to do with it? If 30% of students are legacy and 60% are the best in the world, the 60% will carry the school. You assume that there is a 60% of absolutely brilliant students, but there is no proof of that.

hgsgm 4y ago
> Top universities don't necessarily have the best students, they have the best academics. What on earth are you trying to say? We are talking about school rankings, not professional researcher rankings. Have you met any brilliant people? Ask them for their opinion. The proof is in their grades, test scores, competition scores, PhD theses and papers, and later work output.
- manuelabeledo 4y ago
  > We are talking about school rankings, not professional researcher rankings That's how university rankings work. This is widely known stuff. If you think that Stanford is up there because they have brilliant students, you are objectively wrong. In fact, there is no standardized way of comparing students of two different institutions other than research work and citations, which makes them, again, part of the academic body.
  - sokoloff 4y ago
    There are literally standardized tests used in admissions. Looking at the averages of those standardized test scores of Stanford students vs other schools will tell a story about the student body that does not come as a surprise to most of us.
    - manuelabeledo 4y ago
      "Stanford is committed to a holistic review of all candidates. We consider the vast array of information provided in and with each student’s application, whether that information includes test scores or not. Students may continue to self-report test scores in their application if they would like. Applications without test scores will not be at a disadvantage." [0] This paints a very different story. Also, the fact that there is a percentage reserved for legacy admissions, invalidates your point completely. [0] https://admission.stanford.edu https://admission.stanford.edu
      - sokoloff 4y ago
        > invalidates your point completely Do you think that Stanford's legacy admission policy makes their student body indistinguishable from that of Pasadena City College? Or that no standardized scoring system would reveal any population-wide differences in academic ability between a school which admits 1 of 25 applicants from another that admits 25 of 25 applicants? Hell, admissions rate alone is probably enough to tell a pretty good part of the story.