4 ms·

He voted for Obama, Clinton and Biden, so no, not really.

epgui 4y ago
I mean Obama was just a strong choice, and what exactly was the alternative when Clinton and Biden ran? Honestly, not casting a completely insane vote doesn't mean much.
- mlindner 4y ago
  I’m not sure what you’re trying to say. A hardcore Republican votes for Republican candidates, of which there was reasonably popular versions of for each election. I wasn’t claiming he was a Democrat, just that he wasn’t a “hardcore Republican”.
  - epgui 4y ago
    I was just assuming you could be "hardcore" and still somewhat pragmatic or reasonable, but I'm with ya. (eg.: I'm "hardcore pro-science", but I wouldn't vote for someone I thought was a pro-science evil person. This example doesn't compare to what we're talking about, it's just to illustrate my own point in this comment.)
    - mlindner 4y ago
      The people who vote for a candidate generally don't think they're evil either.
      - epgui 4y ago
        I'd argue that most people don't think, period... haha. I totally know what you mean, and the key is whether someone has the ability to be critical about and vary their own default position, if you will. This can be very difficult to ascertain, because it's often a matter of counter-factuals.
- decafninja 4y ago
  Playing devil’s advocate because I agree with you, but there are plenty of people who would have said: “I mean McCain/Romney was just a strong choice, and what was the alternative (to voting for Trump) when Clinton and Biden ran? Honestly, not casting a completely insane vote (for Clinton or Biden) doesn’t mean much”. Granted there does seem to have been a division between McCain/Romney voters and Trump voters.
  - epgui 4y ago
    McCain and Romney would not be my preference, but they're not even remotely in the same universe/category/crazy-league/game as Trump. For me it has little to do with affiliation to any of your political parties in the US (not my fight, I'm Canadian). I cannot see a reasonable and/or decent person of moral competence casting a vote for Trump.
    - oska 4y ago
      > I cannot see a reasonable and/or decent person of moral competence casting a vote for Trump. This is an extremely bigoted statement. It's highly ironic, given the morally superior position you are assuming for yourself, that you don't appear able to see that.
      - epgui 4y ago
        I'm very comfortable staying on this side of History. It's a fallacy to think that every choice in every situation is reasonable. More than one choice can be reasonable at the same time, but some choices are patently unreasonable.
        oska 4y ago
        You are saying that every person who voted for Trump is an unreasonable and/or morally deficient person. It is highly arrogant to put yourself in the position to make that call and, as I've already said, only demonstrates a bigoted mindset on your part (that you think you can universally define such a large group of people as inferior based on a single, and very shallow determinant).

I mean Obama was just a strong choice, and what exactly was the alternative when Clinton and Biden ran? Honestly, not casting a completely insane vote doesn't mean much.

mlindner 4y ago
I’m not sure what you’re trying to say. A hardcore Republican votes for Republican candidates, of which there was reasonably popular versions of for each election. I wasn’t claiming he was a Democrat, just that he wasn’t a “hardcore Republican”.
- epgui 4y ago
  I was just assuming you could be "hardcore" and still somewhat pragmatic or reasonable, but I'm with ya. (eg.: I'm "hardcore pro-science", but I wouldn't vote for someone I thought was a pro-science evil person. This example doesn't compare to what we're talking about, it's just to illustrate my own point in this comment.)
  - mlindner 4y ago
    The people who vote for a candidate generally don't think they're evil either.
    - epgui 4y ago
      I'd argue that most people don't think, period... haha. I totally know what you mean, and the key is whether someone has the ability to be critical about and vary their own default position, if you will. This can be very difficult to ascertain, because it's often a matter of counter-factuals.
decafninja 4y ago
Playing devil’s advocate because I agree with you, but there are plenty of people who would have said: “I mean McCain/Romney was just a strong choice, and what was the alternative (to voting for Trump) when Clinton and Biden ran? Honestly, not casting a completely insane vote (for Clinton or Biden) doesn’t mean much”. Granted there does seem to have been a division between McCain/Romney voters and Trump voters.
- epgui 4y ago
  McCain and Romney would not be my preference, but they're not even remotely in the same universe/category/crazy-league/game as Trump. For me it has little to do with affiliation to any of your political parties in the US (not my fight, I'm Canadian). I cannot see a reasonable and/or decent person of moral competence casting a vote for Trump.
  - oska 4y ago
    > I cannot see a reasonable and/or decent person of moral competence casting a vote for Trump. This is an extremely bigoted statement. It's highly ironic, given the morally superior position you are assuming for yourself, that you don't appear able to see that.
    - epgui 4y ago
      I'm very comfortable staying on this side of History. It's a fallacy to think that every choice in every situation is reasonable. More than one choice can be reasonable at the same time, but some choices are patently unreasonable.
      - oska 4y ago
        You are saying that every person who voted for Trump is an unreasonable and/or morally deficient person. It is highly arrogant to put yourself in the position to make that call and, as I've already said, only demonstrates a bigoted mindset on your part (that you think you can universally define such a large group of people as inferior based on a single, and very shallow determinant).