3 ms·

I don’t believe a single country on earth stopped the spread, even China succumbed after wounding their economy for years

epgui 4y ago
Infectious diseases spread. If one country is doing all the right things but not enough other countries are, then that country doing all the right things won't be able to stop the spread on its own, even within its geography. That's normal and to be expected. This is why I said coordinated action was required: I didn't say that for no reason.
- monero-xmr 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - epgui 4y ago
    Let's not go down this tangent please. If you genuinely want to discuss this honestly (I am skeptical, but prove me wrong), we should do it in a more appropriate forum / context.
  - tempestn 4y ago
    The initial lockdowns were intended to prevent a rapid spike in cases that would overwhelm the medical system. That was important, and largely successful. If such measure could have been taken in a globally coordinated, and fairly extreme manner, which was never realistic, then in theory the virus could've been eradicated early on. But that doesn't mean they were worthless otherwise. After that period there were measures of varying strictness applied in different areas, some of which were beneficial, and some did more harm than good. Some were based on a mistaken notion that the virus could be locally eradicated. Others were based on good science to blunt spikes of infections, again to reduce strain on the medical system, or to buy time for vaccinations. We can't look at complex issues as black and white.
- mc32 4y ago
  They have an authoritarian government -one which could weld shut windows and doors ignoring any fire safety issues to lock down a block because there was one case… And it still spread. No, 10 days with democratic governments don’t allow one to truthfully say ‘10 days to stop the spread’. It’s either ignorance or willful misinformation/lying.
  - epgui 4y ago
    I think you should read my comment more slowly and more carefully, because if I copy-pasted it right here it would be an adequate response to your response.
    - mc32 4y ago
      Th premise is all governments would have the power to shut things down. They don't. We have civil liberties. It was unfeasible. Even absolute world-wide martial law would not stop it [you can't freeze people in place for ten days straight]. So the statement that it could have been stopped in 10 days if... No, that "if" was not going to happen.
      - epgui 4y ago
        I think you need to draw an actual timeline of all the measures that were taken, and where and when they happened. That should help clarify.
        mc32 4y ago
        Do you recall the very early days when there was a cruise ship where a passenger caught SARS-COV2 and they anchored it in the SF bay and didn't let anyone off even while some succumbed to the disease and treated passengers as if they had Ebola? Yet, it still jumped and infected people (landlubbers). There was no way "10 days to stop the spread" was going to be effective.
        epgui 4y ago
- ekianjo 4y ago
  > This is why I said coordinated action was required: I didn't say that for no reason. Nobody wants more clueless WHO driving things
  - epgui 4y ago
    Nobody wants to pay taxes either, but sometimes doing things we don't want to do is the best way to optimize quality (and quantity) of life for everyone. It all comes down to epidemiology, actuarial science and medical economics.
    - quonn 4y ago
      It comes down to a phantasy world complete with unicorns and all that does not exist anywhere except in your mind.
qu4z-2 4y ago
We repeatedly kicked it out of New Zealand, but eventually you've got to allow overseas travel.
- Bazzas 4y ago
  [flagged]
cameldrv 4y ago
Australia and New Zealand also had COVID fully contained for a long time (not as long as China). It was possible but very difficult. We just weren’t up to the task. The hope was that the vaccine would make COVID like Measles, i.e. a few cases here and there, but you get your shot and basically never worry about it again. Unfortunately the vaccines aren’t good enough/COVID evolves too fast, so we are just living with massive death and disability.

epgui 4y ago

Infectious diseases spread. If one country is doing all the right things but not enough other countries are, then that country doing all the right things won't be able to stop the spread on its own, even within its geography. That's normal and to be expected. This is why I said coordinated action was required: I didn't say that for no reason.

monero-xmr 4y ago
[flagged]
- epgui 4y ago
  Let's not go down this tangent please. If you genuinely want to discuss this honestly (I am skeptical, but prove me wrong), we should do it in a more appropriate forum / context.
- tempestn 4y ago
  The initial lockdowns were intended to prevent a rapid spike in cases that would overwhelm the medical system. That was important, and largely successful. If such measure could have been taken in a globally coordinated, and fairly extreme manner, which was never realistic, then in theory the virus could've been eradicated early on. But that doesn't mean they were worthless otherwise. After that period there were measures of varying strictness applied in different areas, some of which were beneficial, and some did more harm than good. Some were based on a mistaken notion that the virus could be locally eradicated. Others were based on good science to blunt spikes of infections, again to reduce strain on the medical system, or to buy time for vaccinations. We can't look at complex issues as black and white.
mc32 4y ago
They have an authoritarian government -one which could weld shut windows and doors ignoring any fire safety issues to lock down a block because there was one case… And it still spread. No, 10 days with democratic governments don’t allow one to truthfully say ‘10 days to stop the spread’. It’s either ignorance or willful misinformation/lying.
- epgui 4y ago
  I think you should read my comment more slowly and more carefully, because if I copy-pasted it right here it would be an adequate response to your response.
  - mc32 4y ago
    Th premise is all governments would have the power to shut things down. They don't. We have civil liberties. It was unfeasible. Even absolute world-wide martial law would not stop it [you can't freeze people in place for ten days straight]. So the statement that it could have been stopped in 10 days if... No, that "if" was not going to happen.
    - epgui 4y ago
      I think you need to draw an actual timeline of all the measures that were taken, and where and when they happened. That should help clarify.
      - mc32 4y ago
        Do you recall the very early days when there was a cruise ship where a passenger caught SARS-COV2 and they anchored it in the SF bay and didn't let anyone off even while some succumbed to the disease and treated passengers as if they had Ebola? Yet, it still jumped and infected people (landlubbers). There was no way "10 days to stop the spread" was going to be effective.
        epgui 4y ago
ekianjo 4y ago
> This is why I said coordinated action was required: I didn't say that for no reason. Nobody wants more clueless WHO driving things
- epgui 4y ago
  Nobody wants to pay taxes either, but sometimes doing things we don't want to do is the best way to optimize quality (and quantity) of life for everyone. It all comes down to epidemiology, actuarial science and medical economics.
  - quonn 4y ago
    It comes down to a phantasy world complete with unicorns and all that does not exist anywhere except in your mind.

qu4z-2 4y ago

We repeatedly kicked it out of New Zealand, but eventually you've got to allow overseas travel.

Bazzas 4y ago
[flagged]

cameldrv 4y ago

Australia and New Zealand also had COVID fully contained for a long time (not as long as China). It was possible but very difficult. We just weren’t up to the task. The hope was that the vaccine would make COVID like Measles, i.e. a few cases here and there, but you get your shot and basically never worry about it again. Unfortunately the vaccines aren’t good enough/COVID evolves too fast, so we are just living with massive death and disability.