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> I just wish the guy in charge could apply the same systematic thinking to his approach to politics. What if his political tweets is the result of systematic

> I just wish the guy in charge could apply the same systematic thinking to his approach to politics. What if his political tweets is the result of systematic thinking? If someone holds a viewpoint that differs from ours, does it necessarily imply that their perspective is outrageous and incorrect?

systemvoltage 4y ago
I think Elon is pretty much where he was years ago. Progressives have abandoned classical liberalism. I feel same way. And so do many people (Tobi Lutke, Tim Urban, etc.). Berkeley's free speech movement stands in stark contrast with the DEI marxism going on today on campus.
- saalweachter 4y ago
  I mean, "classical liberalism" as a term was invented to distinguish 18th century ideals from "progressive liberalism", so that's kind of a truism?
theonething 4y ago
> If someone holds a viewpoint that differs from ours, does it necessarily imply that their perspective is outrageous and incorrect? Ironically, in the context of GP's comment, this is a large cause of toxic politics. The demonization of people with different viewpoints and refusal to engage in genuine discourse brews the toxicity.
doctor_eval 4y ago
It's not just his political tweets though. It's also the treatment of employees at Tesla and Twitter. Pedo guy. The private detectives. Selling stuff that doesn't work. All that stuff. Maybe, like most of us, he sometimes fails to meet his personal standards, and regrets some of the things he does, but I've personally lost confidence that this is the case. You don't call someone "pedo guy" without evidence if you are trying to avoid toxic politics.
- tim333 4y ago
  > Unsworth had mocked Musk’s submarine in an interview with CNN, deeming it a “PR stunt” and saying Musk should “stick his submarine where it hurts”. I'm not sure insulting back someone who insults you, one time in several years, makes you an irredeemably toxic person.
  - doctor_eval 4y ago
    You don’t think there’s a problem with the worlds richest man, with a following of millions, calling some effectively random British guy in Thailand a pedophile? You think that was a fair exchange? That these insults were equivalent? That guy’s life was put in jeopardy. Calling him pedo guy was exactly the kind of behaviour I’m calling out.
    - try_the_bass 4y ago
      > You don’t think there’s a problem with the worlds richest man, with a following of millions, calling some effectively random British guy in Thailand a pedophile? I think it's a dick move for sure. However if we follow your line of reasoning, we end up on a world where everyone is free to insult people more powerful than them with no repercussions. This sounds like a recipe for creating a lot of bullies. Bullies tend to continue their behavior and continue to escalate as long as they feel like they're the most powerful person in the room. It's generally only when they pick on someone bigger than them (metaphorically) and get rightly smacked down do they learn the error of those ways. Note that this is a generalization: don't take that to mean that a smackdown is the only way they learn, or that they are guaranteed to learn from it! I'm more of the opinion that if you're going to hurl insults/fists, you deserve whatever happens when someone fights back. It's not like smaller/weaker/less privileged targets are going to have much ability to fight back, so it seems important that the ones who have the ability to retaliate are able to do so, in order to keep bullies in check. > That guy’s life was put in jeopardy. Calling him pedo guy was exactly the kind of behaviour I’m calling out. I find this very hard to believe. This sounds more like the kind of thing someone says when pursuing a lawsuit, because they (strategically) have to.
slg 4y ago
The erraticness of his behavior makes it hard to believe he is thinking systematically. Just look at his leadership of Twitter and you can see him changing his mind constantly about strategic decisions, sometimes daily.

systemvoltage 4y ago

I think Elon is pretty much where he was years ago. Progressives have abandoned classical liberalism. I feel same way. And so do many people (Tobi Lutke, Tim Urban, etc.). Berkeley's free speech movement stands in stark contrast with the DEI marxism going on today on campus.

saalweachter 4y ago
I mean, "classical liberalism" as a term was invented to distinguish 18th century ideals from "progressive liberalism", so that's kind of a truism?

theonething 4y ago

> If someone holds a viewpoint that differs from ours, does it necessarily imply that their perspective is outrageous and incorrect? Ironically, in the context of GP's comment, this is a large cause of toxic politics. The demonization of people with different viewpoints and refusal to engage in genuine discourse brews the toxicity.

doctor_eval 4y ago

It's not just his political tweets though. It's also the treatment of employees at Tesla and Twitter. Pedo guy. The private detectives. Selling stuff that doesn't work. All that stuff. Maybe, like most of us, he sometimes fails to meet his personal standards, and regrets some of the things he does, but I've personally lost confidence that this is the case. You don't call someone "pedo guy" without evidence if you are trying to avoid toxic politics.

tim333 4y ago
> Unsworth had mocked Musk’s submarine in an interview with CNN, deeming it a “PR stunt” and saying Musk should “stick his submarine where it hurts”. I'm not sure insulting back someone who insults you, one time in several years, makes you an irredeemably toxic person.
- doctor_eval 4y ago
  You don’t think there’s a problem with the worlds richest man, with a following of millions, calling some effectively random British guy in Thailand a pedophile? You think that was a fair exchange? That these insults were equivalent? That guy’s life was put in jeopardy. Calling him pedo guy was exactly the kind of behaviour I’m calling out.
  - try_the_bass 4y ago
    > You don’t think there’s a problem with the worlds richest man, with a following of millions, calling some effectively random British guy in Thailand a pedophile? I think it's a dick move for sure. However if we follow your line of reasoning, we end up on a world where everyone is free to insult people more powerful than them with no repercussions. This sounds like a recipe for creating a lot of bullies. Bullies tend to continue their behavior and continue to escalate as long as they feel like they're the most powerful person in the room. It's generally only when they pick on someone bigger than them (metaphorically) and get rightly smacked down do they learn the error of those ways. Note that this is a generalization: don't take that to mean that a smackdown is the only way they learn, or that they are guaranteed to learn from it! I'm more of the opinion that if you're going to hurl insults/fists, you deserve whatever happens when someone fights back. It's not like smaller/weaker/less privileged targets are going to have much ability to fight back, so it seems important that the ones who have the ability to retaliate are able to do so, in order to keep bullies in check. > That guy’s life was put in jeopardy. Calling him pedo guy was exactly the kind of behaviour I’m calling out. I find this very hard to believe. This sounds more like the kind of thing someone says when pursuing a lawsuit, because they (strategically) have to.

slg 4y ago

The erraticness of his behavior makes it hard to believe he is thinking systematically. Just look at his leadership of Twitter and you can see him changing his mind constantly about strategic decisions, sometimes daily.