4 ms·

Worth pointing out that no European country has a cash bail system, yet many of them manage to have cities with much lower crime rates than SF. Cash bail isn't

by muglug 4y ago

Worth pointing out that no European country has a cash bail system, yet many of them manage to have cities with much lower crime rates than SF. Cash bail isn't "tough on crime" policy — it's a "keep penniless people in jail" policy, since non-violent crimes like petty larceny are more likely to be committed by poor people.

jeffbee 4y ago
No European country has decades-long prison sentences, either.
- muglug 4y ago
  That's not true — every European country except for Portugal has life imprisonment. But they generally do have shorter sentences for the same crimes than the US.
  - jeffbee 4y ago
    "Life imprisonment" in e.g. Germany is an indefinite sentence with parole eligibility at 15 years, 18 years in France, 15 years in Belgium, etc. According to Wikipedia there are currently 550 inmates serving indefinite sentences in France, and 33000 inmates serving life sentences in California.
    - bmelton 4y ago
      I think that's generally true in America as well. A "one-life" sentence in America generally amounts to 15-25 before parole eligibility. I don't know the prevalence of back-to-back life sentences in Germany (or in America, really) but we have some oddities like the Green River Killer, who got a life sentence for every murder he pled guilty to committing, so he's serving 48 life sentences consecutively. I am as impressed with France's low percentage of life (indefinite) sentences as I am shocked that California's 160+% life detention rate despite having almost half the population.
- chmod775 4y ago
  Worth pointing that there's no such thing as "police not responding" in many European countries either. Just a heated argument with your neighbor and someone calls the police? They're going to show up even if no crime is being committed, try to mediate and diffuse the situation - because their multi-year training covered that as well, not just the application of government-sanctioned violence. I don't think long sentences work as a deterrent if there's just a low expectation of the chaps in uniforms even putting in any work.

by muglug 4y ago

jeffbee 4y ago

No European country has decades-long prison sentences, either.

muglug 4y ago
That's not true — every European country except for Portugal has life imprisonment. But they generally do have shorter sentences for the same crimes than the US.
- jeffbee 4y ago
  "Life imprisonment" in e.g. Germany is an indefinite sentence with parole eligibility at 15 years, 18 years in France, 15 years in Belgium, etc. According to Wikipedia there are currently 550 inmates serving indefinite sentences in France, and 33000 inmates serving life sentences in California.
  - bmelton 4y ago
    I think that's generally true in America as well. A "one-life" sentence in America generally amounts to 15-25 before parole eligibility. I don't know the prevalence of back-to-back life sentences in Germany (or in America, really) but we have some oddities like the Green River Killer, who got a life sentence for every murder he pled guilty to committing, so he's serving 48 life sentences consecutively. I am as impressed with France's low percentage of life (indefinite) sentences as I am shocked that California's 160+% life detention rate despite having almost half the population.
chmod775 4y ago
Worth pointing that there's no such thing as "police not responding" in many European countries either. Just a heated argument with your neighbor and someone calls the police? They're going to show up even if no crime is being committed, try to mediate and diffuse the situation - because their multi-year training covered that as well, not just the application of government-sanctioned violence. I don't think long sentences work as a deterrent if there's just a low expectation of the chaps in uniforms even putting in any work.