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I attended some lessons on Thibault's Destreza [0] and it was fascinating. Thibault seems to be one of the more approachable Destreza systems. Most of texts on

I attended some lessons on Thibault's Destreza [0] and it was fascinating. Thibault seems to be one of the more approachable Destreza systems. Most of texts on Destreza are near unreadable. This had lead to a theory that some Destreza texts are cover texts for occult practices or alchemical recipes. Such claims were remarked on both during the time the texts were published and in the present day. [0]: https://wiktenauer.com/wiki/G%C3%A9rard_Thibault_d%27Anvers https://wiktenauer.com/wiki/G%C3%A9rard_Thibault_d%27Anvers

pavel_lishin 4y ago
I did a tiny bit of HEMA - historical european martial arts. Basically, fencing with longswords, and other European stuff. Those writings were also... very difficult to read. One reason was that the teachers wanted you to learn from them, not from copies of their texts. The texts alone weren't meant to teach you; they're meant to be somewhat inscrutable.
- EthanHeilman 4y ago
  Yeah, strong agree. Some of the early German sources are intentionally obscured as secret knowledge: Liechtenauer whose Zettel is often seen as the beginning of the German tradition despite Liechtenauer saying he learned it from others. "Because the art belongs to princes and lords, knights and squires, and they should know and learn this art, he has written of this art in hidden and secret words, so that not everyone will grasp and understand it, as you will find described below. And he has done this on account of frivolous fight masters who mistake the art as trivial, so that such masters will not make his art common or open with people who do not hold the art in respect as is its due." [0] The German is: "verborgen vnd verdackten wortten" which Google translates as "hidden and covered words". [0]: https://wiktenauer.com/wiki/Johannes_Liechtenauer#Long_Sword https://wiktenauer.com/wiki/Johannes_Liechtenauer#Long_Sword
  - pavel_lishin 4y ago
    That name definitely rang a bell! I kinda miss doing it. I need to find another sport.
    - EthanHeilman 4y ago
      Where do you live? There are clubs lots of places these days.
erk__ 4y ago
This [0] video from the YouTube channel Objectivity looks at Thibault's book which was the first thing I thought about when I saw this post. [0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdVZzB2nR5M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdVZzB2nR5M

pavel_lishin 4y ago

I did a tiny bit of HEMA - historical european martial arts. Basically, fencing with longswords, and other European stuff. Those writings were also... very difficult to read. One reason was that the teachers wanted you to learn from them, not from copies of their texts. The texts alone weren't meant to teach you; they're meant to be somewhat inscrutable.

EthanHeilman 4y ago
Yeah, strong agree. Some of the early German sources are intentionally obscured as secret knowledge: Liechtenauer whose Zettel is often seen as the beginning of the German tradition despite Liechtenauer saying he learned it from others. "Because the art belongs to princes and lords, knights and squires, and they should know and learn this art, he has written of this art in hidden and secret words, so that not everyone will grasp and understand it, as you will find described below. And he has done this on account of frivolous fight masters who mistake the art as trivial, so that such masters will not make his art common or open with people who do not hold the art in respect as is its due." [0] The German is: "verborgen vnd verdackten wortten" which Google translates as "hidden and covered words". [0]: https://wiktenauer.com/wiki/Johannes_Liechtenauer#Long_Sword https://wiktenauer.com/wiki/Johannes_Liechtenauer#Long_Sword
- pavel_lishin 4y ago
  That name definitely rang a bell! I kinda miss doing it. I need to find another sport.
  - EthanHeilman 4y ago
    Where do you live? There are clubs lots of places these days.

erk__ 4y ago

This [0] video from the YouTube channel Objectivity looks at Thibault's book which was the first thing I thought about when I saw this post. [0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdVZzB2nR5M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdVZzB2nR5M