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> In selecting a woman and a person of colour, Nasa is keeping its promise to bring greater diversity to its exploration efforts. I wish people would stop prom

> In selecting a woman and a person of colour, Nasa is keeping its promise to bring greater diversity to its exploration efforts. I wish people would stop promising diversity and just select people. Looking at their background, everyone selected is super qualified and seems like a great match. The diversity promise does nothing except make people doubt their credentials. You see it also with the Vice President. Kamala Harris is talented in her own right, but Biden’s promise before he selected her made it seem like she was not. He should have just selected her without making the promise.

bena 4y ago
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- Thuggery 4y ago
  > Only assholes think like that. Only assholes doubt credentials because we are now trying to explicitly defy our biases. And/or people capable of unpopular rational thinking and noticing patterns. You can't aim to select people for characteristics other than pure merit and at the same time claim merit is the deciding factor in selection - well, short of amazing coincidence. - We promise to select someone biologically related to Congress - We have selected Mark who is a nephew of a prominent senator and really the only one available in the pool that meets the above qualifications - But Mark is just as qualified if not more so than anyone else. He was selected on merit just like everyone else! You seriously believe this shit? You expect other people to? > That it's only a coincidence that every single astronaut during the Apollo missions was a white man. That they were all definitely above every possible non-white non-man. Are you seriously implying that the past Moon missions were not selecting organically for the most qualified they thought they thought they had, but rather as some sort of identity politics conspiracy against non-whites and women? Serious projection. Evil white males do not control space and access to it. Anyone qualified that thinks they can pull off a lunar mission is free to try.
  - bena 4y ago
    Are you seriously trying to flip this around? No one is saying "pure merit" got these people on the mission. But they are all qualified. They can all get the job done. They do have the credentials. Beyond that, they have other qualities that tipped the scale in their favor to be selected. "Pure meritocracy" is a myth. And it's funny you're trying to say the Artemis 2 crew was not selected due to "pure merit", but then want to suggest that all of the Apollo missions were. I'm not implying the Apollo missions were not selecting based on whatever weird conspiracy narrative you've concocted. I'm saying that racism and sexism in the 60s and 70s was more the norm than the exception. And that's why your qualifier of "most qualified they thought they had" is doing a lot of heavy lifting. They didn't think much of women or minorities. Their biases favored white men. Not to mention all the biases all the way down. White men would have had an easier time to get access to the education and training to be able to be considered to be an astronaut. So before you accuse others of projection, make sure you aren't the one in the booth.
- matt-attack 4y ago
  So you’re an asshole if you think critically and notice obvious patterns? At Stanford in the mid-90s it was quite apparent to anyone with a head not buried in the sand, that certain groups of minorities performed at drastically lower levels than their peers. Any rational observer who was aware that the school preferred to admit applicants with brown skin, and then detected the obvious pattern of low performance in those groups, was not necessarily an asshole for noticing that. Christ, this observation was not even lost on those members of that group in fact. Observing reality is never wrong.

bena 4y ago

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Thuggery 4y ago
> Only assholes think like that. Only assholes doubt credentials because we are now trying to explicitly defy our biases. And/or people capable of unpopular rational thinking and noticing patterns. You can't aim to select people for characteristics other than pure merit and at the same time claim merit is the deciding factor in selection - well, short of amazing coincidence. - We promise to select someone biologically related to Congress - We have selected Mark who is a nephew of a prominent senator and really the only one available in the pool that meets the above qualifications - But Mark is just as qualified if not more so than anyone else. He was selected on merit just like everyone else! You seriously believe this shit? You expect other people to? > That it's only a coincidence that every single astronaut during the Apollo missions was a white man. That they were all definitely above every possible non-white non-man. Are you seriously implying that the past Moon missions were not selecting organically for the most qualified they thought they thought they had, but rather as some sort of identity politics conspiracy against non-whites and women? Serious projection. Evil white males do not control space and access to it. Anyone qualified that thinks they can pull off a lunar mission is free to try.
- bena 4y ago
  Are you seriously trying to flip this around? No one is saying "pure merit" got these people on the mission. But they are all qualified. They can all get the job done. They do have the credentials. Beyond that, they have other qualities that tipped the scale in their favor to be selected. "Pure meritocracy" is a myth. And it's funny you're trying to say the Artemis 2 crew was not selected due to "pure merit", but then want to suggest that all of the Apollo missions were. I'm not implying the Apollo missions were not selecting based on whatever weird conspiracy narrative you've concocted. I'm saying that racism and sexism in the 60s and 70s was more the norm than the exception. And that's why your qualifier of "most qualified they thought they had" is doing a lot of heavy lifting. They didn't think much of women or minorities. Their biases favored white men. Not to mention all the biases all the way down. White men would have had an easier time to get access to the education and training to be able to be considered to be an astronaut. So before you accuse others of projection, make sure you aren't the one in the booth.
matt-attack 4y ago
So you’re an asshole if you think critically and notice obvious patterns? At Stanford in the mid-90s it was quite apparent to anyone with a head not buried in the sand, that certain groups of minorities performed at drastically lower levels than their peers. Any rational observer who was aware that the school preferred to admit applicants with brown skin, and then detected the obvious pattern of low performance in those groups, was not necessarily an asshole for noticing that. Christ, this observation was not even lost on those members of that group in fact. Observing reality is never wrong.