4 ms·

"If you do this and someone objects, you will have your kids taken away. But don't worry, people very rarely object! You don't have anyone in your neighborhood

"If you do this and someone objects, you will have your kids taken away. But don't worry, people very rarely object! You don't have anyone in your neighborhood that really doesn't like you, right?" This is not nearly as reassuring as you may think it is.

samtho 4y ago
I suppose it’s hard for me to really understand this situation. I live in a mixed-income neighborhood within a major US city and there are tons of kids that walk around in transit to/from school, the park, the bus stop, with younger kid always accompanied by older ones (10 and up). My neighborhood is fairly tight knit and if a kid goes “missing”, it’s usually because their phone died or something and the parent overreacted after not being able to reach them. I would be concerned if I see a kid walking alone without any clear purpose/destination, but even then, an isolated incident is not going to be a call to CPS.
- laverya 4y ago
  > I would be concerned if I see a kid walking alone without any clear purpose/destination, but even then, an isolated incident is not going to be a call to CPS. You're damning yourself with faint praise, here. Giving kids independence means that they're regularly going to be outside alone (or with friends), and often without a clear purpose or destination. And it's sort of sounding like you'd be considering calling CPS over that.
  - samtho 4y ago
    The situation I was trying to describe is when a kid is clearly lost, not just playing around. This is a concern I would have if I saw an adult in the situation with a similar remedy: ask if they need help.
- 4bpp 4y ago
  > I would be concerned if I see a kid walking alone without any clear purpose/destination, but even then, an isolated incident is not going to be a call to CPS. Do you realise how threatening this sounds? You are all but implying that if you, conversely, see a kid outside a few times and can't figure out their purpose/destination, you might just call CPS. I wouldn't trust most kids to manage to look unambiguously purposeful to adult strangers most of the time (when I myself was in 4th grade and going to a primary school in a neighbouring town, I would frequently get distracted by something and miss three or four once-in-30-minutes buses in a row), so you're essentially saying that you may CPS on a whim after seeing the same kid multiple times in a row. If I lived in the US and knew I had neighbours like that, I would not risk letting any kids go outside on their own.
  - brailsafe 4y ago
    I think this is a logically unsound, or at best uncharitable interpretation. My read of it is simply that calling CPS would hypothetically be an exaggerated reaction, even in circumstances that are unusual in their day to day context, and would require at least a higher bar if not much higher bar, and presumably other measures having been taken, like talking to them
- qball 4y ago
  >I would be concerned if I see a kid walking alone without any clear purpose/destination Yeah, God fucking forbid they exercise their human right to movement in a way that offends your sensibilities.
  - samtho 4y ago
    That’s more out of a concern of are they lost or needing help.
franga2000 4y ago
The objection here isn't "I don't have neighbours that would do that", it's "even if they do, CPS would laugh in their face because this is a normal thing for a child to be doing". At worst, they might come by to ask some questions the first time. It would seem there are in fact a handful of crazy CPS workers out there that think this is truly unacceptable, but there's a ridiculously tiny chance of you getting one of those and it is my understanding you can still fight them in court if the case ever gets that far.
- sidlls 4y ago
  It likely varies by region and social standards within different communities. I personally know people who have had CPS called on them because they let their kids (young teens, around 13 or so) walk to the store (~0.5 miles) alone. It's not a "ridiculously tiny chance", where I live. And nobody should have to fight them in court: that's the whole point--the fact that it can get that far, or even as far as a single CPS visit for "some questions", is beyond absurd. It's a ridiculous stripping of autonomy and growth for children, and an humiliating and infuriating experience for parents.
  - franga2000 4y ago
    My whole point was that while CPS might get called by some idiot neighbour, the chance of them doing anything is basically nonexistent, especially not something as drastic as taking away custody. It reduces down to: "I'm not going to do [perfectly legal and normal thing] because [person who doesn't like me] might report me to [authority figure]". By that logic, I shouldn't eat meat because my vegan neighbour might report me to the police for murder. When I was a teen, me and my friends had the cops called on us me multiple times for things as absurd as sitting on the stairs in the building I lived in or rollerblading up and down the street, but every time, the cops kindly explained to the grumpy old pensioner that called them that this was perfectly legal, nobody was being harmed and to not call about nonsense like that again. People always have and always will try to report others for things they don't like. But that's like half of the cops' or CPS's job - to take those reports, figure out what actually counts as a crime, investigate whether it actually happened and only then charge the suspect.

samtho 4y ago

I suppose it’s hard for me to really understand this situation. I live in a mixed-income neighborhood within a major US city and there are tons of kids that walk around in transit to/from school, the park, the bus stop, with younger kid always accompanied by older ones (10 and up). My neighborhood is fairly tight knit and if a kid goes “missing”, it’s usually because their phone died or something and the parent overreacted after not being able to reach them. I would be concerned if I see a kid walking alone without any clear purpose/destination, but even then, an isolated incident is not going to be a call to CPS.

laverya 4y ago
> I would be concerned if I see a kid walking alone without any clear purpose/destination, but even then, an isolated incident is not going to be a call to CPS. You're damning yourself with faint praise, here. Giving kids independence means that they're regularly going to be outside alone (or with friends), and often without a clear purpose or destination. And it's sort of sounding like you'd be considering calling CPS over that.
- samtho 4y ago
  The situation I was trying to describe is when a kid is clearly lost, not just playing around. This is a concern I would have if I saw an adult in the situation with a similar remedy: ask if they need help.
4bpp 4y ago
> I would be concerned if I see a kid walking alone without any clear purpose/destination, but even then, an isolated incident is not going to be a call to CPS. Do you realise how threatening this sounds? You are all but implying that if you, conversely, see a kid outside a few times and can't figure out their purpose/destination, you might just call CPS. I wouldn't trust most kids to manage to look unambiguously purposeful to adult strangers most of the time (when I myself was in 4th grade and going to a primary school in a neighbouring town, I would frequently get distracted by something and miss three or four once-in-30-minutes buses in a row), so you're essentially saying that you may CPS on a whim after seeing the same kid multiple times in a row. If I lived in the US and knew I had neighbours like that, I would not risk letting any kids go outside on their own.
- brailsafe 4y ago
  I think this is a logically unsound, or at best uncharitable interpretation. My read of it is simply that calling CPS would hypothetically be an exaggerated reaction, even in circumstances that are unusual in their day to day context, and would require at least a higher bar if not much higher bar, and presumably other measures having been taken, like talking to them
qball 4y ago
>I would be concerned if I see a kid walking alone without any clear purpose/destination Yeah, God fucking forbid they exercise their human right to movement in a way that offends your sensibilities.
- samtho 4y ago
  That’s more out of a concern of are they lost or needing help.

franga2000 4y ago

The objection here isn't "I don't have neighbours that would do that", it's "even if they do, CPS would laugh in their face because this is a normal thing for a child to be doing". At worst, they might come by to ask some questions the first time. It would seem there are in fact a handful of crazy CPS workers out there that think this is truly unacceptable, but there's a ridiculously tiny chance of you getting one of those and it is my understanding you can still fight them in court if the case ever gets that far.

sidlls 4y ago
It likely varies by region and social standards within different communities. I personally know people who have had CPS called on them because they let their kids (young teens, around 13 or so) walk to the store (~0.5 miles) alone. It's not a "ridiculously tiny chance", where I live. And nobody should have to fight them in court: that's the whole point--the fact that it can get that far, or even as far as a single CPS visit for "some questions", is beyond absurd. It's a ridiculous stripping of autonomy and growth for children, and an humiliating and infuriating experience for parents.
- franga2000 4y ago
  My whole point was that while CPS might get called by some idiot neighbour, the chance of them doing anything is basically nonexistent, especially not something as drastic as taking away custody. It reduces down to: "I'm not going to do [perfectly legal and normal thing] because [person who doesn't like me] might report me to [authority figure]". By that logic, I shouldn't eat meat because my vegan neighbour might report me to the police for murder. When I was a teen, me and my friends had the cops called on us me multiple times for things as absurd as sitting on the stairs in the building I lived in or rollerblading up and down the street, but every time, the cops kindly explained to the grumpy old pensioner that called them that this was perfectly legal, nobody was being harmed and to not call about nonsense like that again. People always have and always will try to report others for things they don't like. But that's like half of the cops' or CPS's job - to take those reports, figure out what actually counts as a crime, investigate whether it actually happened and only then charge the suspect.