7 ms·

ggerganov commented Apr 2, 2023 So this is pretty stupid - I just lost my Sunday trying to figure out how to salvage this stupid drama @anzz1 and @jart You a

ggerganov commented Apr 2, 2023 So this is pretty stupid - I just lost my Sunday trying to figure out how to salvage this stupid drama @anzz1 and @jart You are no longer welcome as collaborators to the project.

fastball 4y ago
What is the purpose of re-posting a comment in the linked thread here verbatim?
- Operyl 4y ago
  Updated context for those who read the issue before it was posted, that wasn’t there during the time of the original submission.
qwertox 4y ago
But you should quote it completely, else it's manipulation: > You are no longer welcome as collaborators to the project. I know you really care about it and only doing it because you really want to make it better - I'm 100% sure about this. But in fact, you are doing the opposite. And if you fail to see this - I'm sorry
- xiphias2 4y ago
  It's really bad reply from Greg. He's the owner of the project, he has the power to accept / not accept changes, and he didn't object to the version change, now he pushes responsibility to the contributors. It's ugly way of dealing with other people. The way to solve this situation is to set up a video call between them to deescalate the emotional part of the situation (which is not a big deal anyways, we can wait a few days for the technical details to get resolved).
  - jart 4y ago
    Then he'd have to do a video call between him, myself, and 4chan.
    - azeirah 4y ago
      huh? Of all things what does 4chan have to do with anything here?
      - jart 4y ago
        See https://rentry.org/Jarted https://rentry.org/Jarted I'm not sure if it's 4chan but it appears to be some chan. When I was working on solving the mmap() problem in https://github.com/ggerganov/llama.cpp/issues/91 https://github.com/ggerganov/llama.cpp/issues/91 (that issue tracks the full history) I originally wrote a malloc() hack to prove zero latency load times could work. But I thought we should hold off and wait until we could fix the file format before merging anything into master. A week or so later, an anonymous GitHub user called Slarin pointed out something really smart. He said the 7B model only has 1D tensors, so we could bring the benefits of mmap() to 7B users right away. My file format change would have solved it for all models. But it wasn't ready yet. So when Slarin asked me to abandon my mmap branch, start over, and use his change as the starting point, I said sure. Since that would have ensured users of the project get some benefit as soon as possible. And we could iterate. So Slarin and I collaborated on Discord. I had a really positive impression. As far as I knew, everything was fine. Slarin made a pull request, which he kept in draft mode. The work he was doing was basically to (1) call mmap() to load the full weights into memory, and (2) update the tensor->data instead of calling read() if the tensor was 1D. The issue is he Slarin got blocked on getting the WIN32 support to work. He had difficulties getting it to not crash. And by the time he was blocked, I had already finished rewriting the file format and data conversion tools. So I said, since I'm done with the full change, just push whatever you did to your PR branch, and I'll just rebase on that, I'll fix your WIN32 code, and then we'll merge our commits as part of the same PR. That PR was https://github.com/ggerganov/llama.cpp/pull/613 https://github.com/ggerganov/llama.cpp/pull/613 where I was very careful to recognize and document all of Slarin's contributions, which are now reflected in the master branch. Slarin agreed, and told me "it looks like you've got this situation handled" and then left. We haven't seen him on the Discord since. I honestly had no idea he was so unhappy about the way things went. It really bums me out, because I have no way of ensuring people stay happy if they don't tell me they're unhappy. It appears, based on the link above, that Slarin felt I had put him in charge of the mmap() contribution and that the change belonged to him because his work was going to be its genesis once merged in the master branch. After the contribution went viral, he probably felt I didn't do enough to give him credit (I'm not exactly sure how to credit an anonymous developer more than I did?) and as a result he went to an online forum to ask a troll brigade to give justice. The fallout of that "chan" troll brigade, is what you see here. They've also been going after my Wikipedia page among other things. I'm probably never going to work with an anonymous person again. I'm a public figure. I live with the sword of damocles hanging over my head. The power that gives anonymous people over me is really quite huge. The consequences here have damaged my reputation and career. And I don't even know who I'd reach out to if I wanted to mediate this. Quite a shame.
  - fastball 4y ago
    Not super surprising. These projects have (understandably given the current environment) blown up in the last few weeks. The level of exposure / pace / etc is something very few people in general are probably equipped to deal with.
    - xiphias2 4y ago
      I agree. Also as a person who tried to contribute to open source projects, I understand the pressure Jart had to put all his changes into 1 big change instead of splitting it up to pieces: there's always a power asymmetry that favors the project maintainer by default as he's getting more famous (which happened to Greg). If Jart would have tried to do everything the ,,proper way'', this change wouldn't have had this visibility, and he would have had much harder time to change the memory layout in the file. I think things are going great, I just wish people would be able to not care about the negative feedback part that comes with it naturally.
      - eecc 3y ago
        looks like a she/her, and she _might_ have mis-appropriated attribution. Not sure, but we live in a world that doesn't assume good-will. https://rentry.org/Jarted https://rentry.org/Jarted
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
IAmNotACellist 4y ago
[flagged]

fastball 4y ago

What is the purpose of re-posting a comment in the linked thread here verbatim?

Operyl 4y ago
Updated context for those who read the issue before it was posted, that wasn’t there during the time of the original submission.

qwertox 4y ago

But you should quote it completely, else it's manipulation: > You are no longer welcome as collaborators to the project. I know you really care about it and only doing it because you really want to make it better - I'm 100% sure about this. But in fact, you are doing the opposite. And if you fail to see this - I'm sorry

xiphias2 4y ago
It's really bad reply from Greg. He's the owner of the project, he has the power to accept / not accept changes, and he didn't object to the version change, now he pushes responsibility to the contributors. It's ugly way of dealing with other people. The way to solve this situation is to set up a video call between them to deescalate the emotional part of the situation (which is not a big deal anyways, we can wait a few days for the technical details to get resolved).
- jart 4y ago
  Then he'd have to do a video call between him, myself, and 4chan.
  - azeirah 4y ago
    huh? Of all things what does 4chan have to do with anything here?
    - jart 4y ago
      See https://rentry.org/Jarted https://rentry.org/Jarted I'm not sure if it's 4chan but it appears to be some chan. When I was working on solving the mmap() problem in https://github.com/ggerganov/llama.cpp/issues/91 https://github.com/ggerganov/llama.cpp/issues/91 (that issue tracks the full history) I originally wrote a malloc() hack to prove zero latency load times could work. But I thought we should hold off and wait until we could fix the file format before merging anything into master. A week or so later, an anonymous GitHub user called Slarin pointed out something really smart. He said the 7B model only has 1D tensors, so we could bring the benefits of mmap() to 7B users right away. My file format change would have solved it for all models. But it wasn't ready yet. So when Slarin asked me to abandon my mmap branch, start over, and use his change as the starting point, I said sure. Since that would have ensured users of the project get some benefit as soon as possible. And we could iterate. So Slarin and I collaborated on Discord. I had a really positive impression. As far as I knew, everything was fine. Slarin made a pull request, which he kept in draft mode. The work he was doing was basically to (1) call mmap() to load the full weights into memory, and (2) update the tensor->data instead of calling read() if the tensor was 1D. The issue is he Slarin got blocked on getting the WIN32 support to work. He had difficulties getting it to not crash. And by the time he was blocked, I had already finished rewriting the file format and data conversion tools. So I said, since I'm done with the full change, just push whatever you did to your PR branch, and I'll just rebase on that, I'll fix your WIN32 code, and then we'll merge our commits as part of the same PR. That PR was https://github.com/ggerganov/llama.cpp/pull/613 https://github.com/ggerganov/llama.cpp/pull/613 where I was very careful to recognize and document all of Slarin's contributions, which are now reflected in the master branch. Slarin agreed, and told me "it looks like you've got this situation handled" and then left. We haven't seen him on the Discord since. I honestly had no idea he was so unhappy about the way things went. It really bums me out, because I have no way of ensuring people stay happy if they don't tell me they're unhappy. It appears, based on the link above, that Slarin felt I had put him in charge of the mmap() contribution and that the change belonged to him because his work was going to be its genesis once merged in the master branch. After the contribution went viral, he probably felt I didn't do enough to give him credit (I'm not exactly sure how to credit an anonymous developer more than I did?) and as a result he went to an online forum to ask a troll brigade to give justice. The fallout of that "chan" troll brigade, is what you see here. They've also been going after my Wikipedia page among other things. I'm probably never going to work with an anonymous person again. I'm a public figure. I live with the sword of damocles hanging over my head. The power that gives anonymous people over me is really quite huge. The consequences here have damaged my reputation and career. And I don't even know who I'd reach out to if I wanted to mediate this. Quite a shame.
- fastball 4y ago
  Not super surprising. These projects have (understandably given the current environment) blown up in the last few weeks. The level of exposure / pace / etc is something very few people in general are probably equipped to deal with.
  - xiphias2 4y ago
    I agree. Also as a person who tried to contribute to open source projects, I understand the pressure Jart had to put all his changes into 1 big change instead of splitting it up to pieces: there's always a power asymmetry that favors the project maintainer by default as he's getting more famous (which happened to Greg). If Jart would have tried to do everything the ,,proper way'', this change wouldn't have had this visibility, and he would have had much harder time to change the memory layout in the file. I think things are going great, I just wish people would be able to not care about the negative feedback part that comes with it naturally.
    - eecc 3y ago
      looks like a she/her, and she _might_ have mis-appropriated attribution. Not sure, but we live in a world that doesn't assume good-will. https://rentry.org/Jarted https://rentry.org/Jarted

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

IAmNotACellist 4y ago

[flagged]