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> In the Western system, Surely they mean "in the English system". In German, we have "Milliarde" between "Millionen" and "Billionen", and so on. In fact, the

by sva_ 4y ago

> In the Western system, Surely they mean "in the English system". In German, we have "Milliarde" between "Millionen" and "Billionen", and so on. In fact, they will end on "-illion" if it's a power of 10^(6n) and on "-illiarde" if it's a power of 10^(6n+3).

andreareina 4y ago
c.f. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_and_short_scales https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_and_short_scales
midasuni 4y ago
In the olden days English used have billion as a million million. For international purposes (america) this “long scale” fall out of use, with he “short scale” being recommended in the U.K. since 1974
- chimeracoder 4y ago
  > For international purposes (america) this “long scale” fall out of use, with he “short scale” being recommended in the U.K. since 1974 I know a lot of people who didn't get that memo, because I still see the long scale with some regularity. That said, the short scale is much more common overall.
  - masfuerte 4y ago
    Where? I'm British and old and, apart from in reference books much older than me, I've never seen the long scale used in any context.
    - chimeracoder 4y ago
      > Where? I'm British and old and, apart from in reference books much older than me, I've never seen the long scale used in any context. Vestiges of it pop up from time to time. It's not really something you can Google directly for, but as an indication, literally the second hit on Google for "thousand million" - a term that only exists due to the long scale, and which is obsolete in the short scale - is an article about a Brexit-related bus ad: https://www.independent.ie/world-news/and-finally/brexit-bus-is-2000-million-a-real-number-or-should-it-be-2-billion-36629390.html https://www.independent.ie/world-news/and-finally/brexit-bus...
- mnw21cam 4y ago
  I'm British, and I'm still sore about this one, even though that "recommendation" was before I was born. The long scale is the right one, darnit. Just because the government says otherwise doesn't make it so. The best thing I can offer is that the word "billion" and greater should be regarded as cursed, ambiguous, and shouldn't be used any more.
adhesive_wombat 4y ago
It used to be like this in British English (the so-called long scale, where milliard was 10^9 and billion was a million millions, 10^12). Now, indeed, the split is roughly along the line of English (and Russian, Turkics and Arabic) on the short scale side and everyone else, especially Continental European language speakers on the other. It's not a universal rule: Brazil is maybe the largest defector from the Continental European group to the short scale, but Canada reinforces the rule by using both, with the choice being dictated by whether you're speaking English or French.
grishka 4y ago
Between? That's odd. In Russian, it goes миллион (million, 10^6), миллиард (milliard, 10^9), триллион (trillion, 10^12), квадриллион (kvadrillion, 10^15), etc in 10^3 increments. "Биллион" isn't a word. It does exist in the macOS dictionary (I just checked) but I've never ever seen or heard it used.
- aix1 4y ago
  In Russian, the word "биллион" is mainly of historic interest: https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%91%D0%B8%D0%BB%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%BE%D0%BD https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%91%D0%B8%D0%BB%D0%BB%D0%B8... (see the note about "Арифметика" Магницкого.) Since Russia uses a short-scale system, the word is no longer in use. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_and_short_scales https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_and_short_scales
throw0101c 4y ago
> Surely they mean "in the English system". It's Wikipedia: feel free to click "Edit" and correct/update it.
- ChoGGi 4y ago
  And then have it reverted soon after.
fabianhjr 4y ago
That's called a long scale (also in use in LATAM) in contrast with a short scale (in use in the US and Canada)

by sva_ 4y ago

andreareina 4y ago

c.f. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_and_short_scales https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_and_short_scales

midasuni 4y ago

In the olden days English used have billion as a million million. For international purposes (america) this “long scale” fall out of use, with he “short scale” being recommended in the U.K. since 1974

chimeracoder 4y ago
> For international purposes (america) this “long scale” fall out of use, with he “short scale” being recommended in the U.K. since 1974 I know a lot of people who didn't get that memo, because I still see the long scale with some regularity. That said, the short scale is much more common overall.
- masfuerte 4y ago
  Where? I'm British and old and, apart from in reference books much older than me, I've never seen the long scale used in any context.
  - chimeracoder 4y ago
    > Where? I'm British and old and, apart from in reference books much older than me, I've never seen the long scale used in any context. Vestiges of it pop up from time to time. It's not really something you can Google directly for, but as an indication, literally the second hit on Google for "thousand million" - a term that only exists due to the long scale, and which is obsolete in the short scale - is an article about a Brexit-related bus ad: https://www.independent.ie/world-news/and-finally/brexit-bus-is-2000-million-a-real-number-or-should-it-be-2-billion-36629390.html https://www.independent.ie/world-news/and-finally/brexit-bus...
mnw21cam 4y ago
I'm British, and I'm still sore about this one, even though that "recommendation" was before I was born. The long scale is the right one, darnit. Just because the government says otherwise doesn't make it so. The best thing I can offer is that the word "billion" and greater should be regarded as cursed, ambiguous, and shouldn't be used any more.

adhesive_wombat 4y ago

It used to be like this in British English (the so-called long scale, where milliard was 10^9 and billion was a million millions, 10^12). Now, indeed, the split is roughly along the line of English (and Russian, Turkics and Arabic) on the short scale side and everyone else, especially Continental European language speakers on the other. It's not a universal rule: Brazil is maybe the largest defector from the Continental European group to the short scale, but Canada reinforces the rule by using both, with the choice being dictated by whether you're speaking English or French.

grishka 4y ago

Between? That's odd. In Russian, it goes миллион (million, 10^6), миллиард (milliard, 10^9), триллион (trillion, 10^12), квадриллион (kvadrillion, 10^15), etc in 10^3 increments. "Биллион" isn't a word. It does exist in the macOS dictionary (I just checked) but I've never ever seen or heard it used.

aix1 4y ago
In Russian, the word "биллион" is mainly of historic interest: https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%91%D0%B8%D0%BB%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%BE%D0%BD https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%91%D0%B8%D0%BB%D0%BB%D0%B8... (see the note about "Арифметика" Магницкого.) Since Russia uses a short-scale system, the word is no longer in use. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_and_short_scales https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_and_short_scales

throw0101c 4y ago

> Surely they mean "in the English system". It's Wikipedia: feel free to click "Edit" and correct/update it.

ChoGGi 4y ago
And then have it reverted soon after.

fabianhjr 4y ago

That's called a long scale (also in use in LATAM) in contrast with a short scale (in use in the US and Canada)