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It makes me think of that astonishing line by Susan Sontag: "The [_] race is the cancer of human history; it is the [_] race and it alone—its ideologies

by 50 4y ago

It makes me think of that astonishing line by Susan Sontag: "The [_____] race is the cancer of human history; it is the [_____] race and it alone—its ideologies and inventions—which eradicates autonomous civilizations wherever it spreads, which has upset the ecological balance of the planet, which now threatens the very existence of life itself." But also Emil Cioran: "What makes bad [technologists] worse is that they [are steeped only in tech-centric thought] (just as bad philosophers read only philosophers), whereas they would benefit much more from a book of botany or geology. We are enriched [and gain a sensible sense of ethics] only by frequenting disciplines remote from our own. This is true, of course, only for realms where the ego is rampant."

germinalphrase 4y ago
Why censor Sontag’s statement? However people feel about her statement, she chose those words.
- jimkleiber 4y ago
  I don't think they were censoring but more so generalizing the statement to more types of races.
- pessimizer 4y ago
  Your instincts are wrong. HN has been a safe place as far as I've ever known (imo you're modded for being unreasonable or irrelevant here - even dumb is fine), but it's not safe to assume that you can say things bluntly in any forum just because they're true and said in good faith. It may read as bravery, but it's really just hubris. They'll delete you and tell other people to delete you. They'll report you to police. They'll ask your friends and family members why they're bad people for not shunning you. Magical incantations and bad words are also the easiest things to avoid while still being very aggressive. Adhering to arbitrary pieties in form is actually a nice shield against people who are allergic to substance.
  - mandmandam 4y ago
    Was recently banned for saying true and important things here. It's not hubris - it's called having a spine.
    - dang 4y ago
      Why not let people decide for themselves why you were banned? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34852986 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34852986
      - mandmandam 4y ago
        Getting a little passive aggressive there dang. I hope people do read that, and the context. There's nothing banworthy there, at least from me. Not unless you're a big fan of tptacek running roughshod over people, as you yourself admit he often does. You also claimed to have "asked me to stop" - which you didn't. And when I asked you where you said that you didn't reply. And when I emailed to ask nicely to be unbanned, as you requested, you ignored it. So... Yeah.
        dang 4y ago
        > There's nothing banworthy there, at least from me You were breaking the site guidelines repeatedly in that thread. > And when I asked you where you said that you didn't reply Sorry — usually I do reply — I must not have seen https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34856255 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34856255. FWIW in retrospect, here are some places where we asked you to stop (I don't remember why I used the word 'just' though, since these are older): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30293928 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30293928 (Feb 2022) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28699914 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28699914 (Sept 2021) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28650525 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28650525 (Sept 2021) > when I emailed to ask nicely to be unbanned, as you requested, you ignored it I can't find any email that references your username. When did you send it?
        4y ago
ChatGTP 4y ago
White race ?
ChatGTP 4y ago
But also Emil Cioran: "What makes bad [technologists] worse is that they [are steeped only in tech-centric thought]“ An absolutely beautiful truth there.
factchecker-123 4y ago
[flagged]
meowface 4y ago
I am going to quote this flagged/removed reply that I think only certain HN users can see, because I think it's important to address: >Since you did not want to quote the whole thing, I will do it for you: >The white race is the cancer of human history; it is the white race and it alone—its ideologies and inventions—which eradicates autonomous civilizations wherever it spreads, which has upset the ecological balance of the planet, which now threatens the very existence of life itself. >And I will point out the obvious thing: yes, she's jewish. Most of the things against the so-called "white race" come from jewish people. Don't trust me, just verify this: every time you see something about "white people blah blah", check the author. 9 out of 10 times it's a jewish person and/or has jewish background. I won't elaborate on the causes, you're free to research yourself. >Then on one side there are no races because we all are the human race. On the other side, there may be races, but we're all equal - well, except if we talk about the "white race", then we can say all kinds of truly trashy things because it's about whites and therefore it's all good. >I wish this would stop already. Hundreds of thousands or perhaps millions of white nationalists and neo-Nazis react this way to such things. I'm not going to respond to it myself (it's total bullshit in many different ways), but just know that there are a lot of people out there who think this way. (And, of course, you don't want to know what this poster is writing on places like 4chan compared to the PR-friendly thing they wrote here.)
- rajin444 4y ago
  Is that full quote supposed to be better? I’m not sure what’s being addressed here, but that you feel comfortable reiterating that an entire race is cancerous is concerning to say the least. What is the end goal of this rhetoric?
  - meowface 4y ago
    I'm not endorsing Sontag's quote at all. I disagree with her and think it's wrong and immoral to exhibit bigotry towards any race or to cast any sort of group judgment like that in general. Plus if any other race had been in the same position they'd very likely be just as rapacious towards the Earth. I think what she describes is a human problem and not a racial problem. I had just wanted to provide the preceding sentences to give it full context. The part I was disagreeing with is the stuff about Jews and what I wanted to address is the specific ways people react to these things. But, you're right. It's totally besides the point and is irrelevant; racism is racism. I removed the full quote.

It makes me think of that astonishing line by Susan Sontag: "The [_____] race is the cancer of human history; it is the [_____] race and it alone—its ideologies

by 50 4y ago

germinalphrase 4y ago

Why censor Sontag’s statement? However people feel about her statement, she chose those words.

jimkleiber 4y ago
I don't think they were censoring but more so generalizing the statement to more types of races.
pessimizer 4y ago
Your instincts are wrong. HN has been a safe place as far as I've ever known (imo you're modded for being unreasonable or irrelevant here - even dumb is fine), but it's not safe to assume that you can say things bluntly in any forum just because they're true and said in good faith. It may read as bravery, but it's really just hubris. They'll delete you and tell other people to delete you. They'll report you to police. They'll ask your friends and family members why they're bad people for not shunning you. Magical incantations and bad words are also the easiest things to avoid while still being very aggressive. Adhering to arbitrary pieties in form is actually a nice shield against people who are allergic to substance.
- mandmandam 4y ago
  Was recently banned for saying true and important things here. It's not hubris - it's called having a spine.
  - dang 4y ago
    Why not let people decide for themselves why you were banned? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34852986 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34852986
    - mandmandam 4y ago
      Getting a little passive aggressive there dang. I hope people do read that, and the context. There's nothing banworthy there, at least from me. Not unless you're a big fan of tptacek running roughshod over people, as you yourself admit he often does. You also claimed to have "asked me to stop" - which you didn't. And when I asked you where you said that you didn't reply. And when I emailed to ask nicely to be unbanned, as you requested, you ignored it. So... Yeah.
      - dang 4y ago
        > There's nothing banworthy there, at least from me You were breaking the site guidelines repeatedly in that thread. > And when I asked you where you said that you didn't reply Sorry — usually I do reply — I must not have seen https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34856255 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34856255. FWIW in retrospect, here are some places where we asked you to stop (I don't remember why I used the word 'just' though, since these are older): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30293928 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30293928 (Feb 2022) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28699914 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28699914 (Sept 2021) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28650525 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28650525 (Sept 2021) > when I emailed to ask nicely to be unbanned, as you requested, you ignored it I can't find any email that references your username. When did you send it?
        4y ago

ChatGTP 4y ago

White race ?

ChatGTP 4y ago

But also Emil Cioran: "What makes bad [technologists] worse is that they [are steeped only in tech-centric thought]“ An absolutely beautiful truth there.

factchecker-123 4y ago

[flagged]

meowface 4y ago

I am going to quote this flagged/removed reply that I think only certain HN users can see, because I think it's important to address: >Since you did not want to quote the whole thing, I will do it for you: >The white race is the cancer of human history; it is the white race and it alone—its ideologies and inventions—which eradicates autonomous civilizations wherever it spreads, which has upset the ecological balance of the planet, which now threatens the very existence of life itself. >And I will point out the obvious thing: yes, she's jewish. Most of the things against the so-called "white race" come from jewish people. Don't trust me, just verify this: every time you see something about "white people blah blah", check the author. 9 out of 10 times it's a jewish person and/or has jewish background. I won't elaborate on the causes, you're free to research yourself. >Then on one side there are no races because we all are the human race. On the other side, there may be races, but we're all equal - well, except if we talk about the "white race", then we can say all kinds of truly trashy things because it's about whites and therefore it's all good. >I wish this would stop already. Hundreds of thousands or perhaps millions of white nationalists and neo-Nazis react this way to such things. I'm not going to respond to it myself (it's total bullshit in many different ways), but just know that there are a lot of people out there who think this way. (And, of course, you don't want to know what this poster is writing on places like 4chan compared to the PR-friendly thing they wrote here.)

rajin444 4y ago
Is that full quote supposed to be better? I’m not sure what’s being addressed here, but that you feel comfortable reiterating that an entire race is cancerous is concerning to say the least. What is the end goal of this rhetoric?
- meowface 4y ago
  I'm not endorsing Sontag's quote at all. I disagree with her and think it's wrong and immoral to exhibit bigotry towards any race or to cast any sort of group judgment like that in general. Plus if any other race had been in the same position they'd very likely be just as rapacious towards the Earth. I think what she describes is a human problem and not a racial problem. I had just wanted to provide the preceding sentences to give it full context. The part I was disagreeing with is the stuff about Jews and what I wanted to address is the specific ways people react to these things. But, you're right. It's totally besides the point and is irrelevant; racism is racism. I removed the full quote.