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Hydrogen fuel cell vehicles do not combust the hydrogen. A fuel cell converts chemical energy to electricity. Batteries also convert chemical energy to electric

Hydrogen fuel cell vehicles do not combust the hydrogen. A fuel cell converts chemical energy to electricity. Batteries also convert chemical energy to electricity.

mrguyorama 4y ago
I think technically the process of oxidizing the hydrogen into H2O IS combustion hah
- _hypx 4y ago
  No. There is no step where heat is an intermediate step. If you relax the definition of combustion that much, even batteries are combusting inside them.
  - Incipient 4y ago
    Wait that means I'm combusting, right now! Oh no. Yeah this thread went off the rails lol. Oops.
otterley 4y ago
Remember that we're focused on mainly on climate impact here, not whether electricity is involved per se as an energy conduit or storage form. The hydrogen used to fuel an FCV has to come from somewhere, and hydrogen is generally produced from hydrocarbons using the catalytic steam-hydrocarbon process. This typically uses fossil fuels like natural gas or methane as an input, and produces CO2 as a byproduct alongside the H2. Compare with BEVs, where the energy used to power the motors can come from clean solar, wind, nuclear, or geothermal generation, without creating (as much) CO2 byproduct. (Yes, there are CO2 byproducts of producing power plants, but the goal is to minimize excess CO2 production, not eliminate it entirely.)
- clouddrover 4y ago
  > Remember that we're focused on mainly on climate impact here No. We're focused on whether or not hydrogen FCEVs are electric vehicles, which they are. > Compare with BEVs, where the energy used to power the motors can come from clean solar, wind, nuclear, or geothermal generation It can also come from coal and diesel and natural gas. None of this is relevant to whether or not FCEVs are electric vehicles.
  - otterley 4y ago
    > No. We're focused on whether or not hydrogen FCEVs are electric vehicles, which they are. The root of this thread was about geopolitical issues, mining, and fossil fuels. It got sidetracked into a puerile squabble about what mechanism makes the wheels turn.
    - clouddrover 4y ago
      You've lost focus. FCEVs are electric vehicles. Admit to that and be happy.
      - otterley 4y ago
        I’ll stipulate that a FCV has an electric powertrain. But so what? An electric powertrain is orthogonal to the source of its fuel and its climate impact. That’s what matters to society. Let’s not ignore the forest for the trees here.
        clouddrover 4y ago
        The "so what" is that you were making a false equivalence between diesel engines and hydrogen fuel cells. But you've made some progress so that's good.
        otterley 4y ago
        I bet you're a lot of fun at parties.
- _hypx 4y ago
  Hydrogen is literally identical to electricity in this regard. It is as green as it's energy source.

Hydrogen fuel cell vehicles do not combust the hydrogen. A fuel cell converts chemical energy to electricity. Batteries also convert chemical energy to electricity.

mrguyorama 4y ago

I think technically the process of oxidizing the hydrogen into H2O IS combustion hah

_hypx 4y ago
No. There is no step where heat is an intermediate step. If you relax the definition of combustion that much, even batteries are combusting inside them.
- Incipient 4y ago
  Wait that means I'm combusting, right now! Oh no. Yeah this thread went off the rails lol. Oops.

otterley 4y ago

Remember that we're focused on mainly on climate impact here, not whether electricity is involved per se as an energy conduit or storage form. The hydrogen used to fuel an FCV has to come from somewhere, and hydrogen is generally produced from hydrocarbons using the catalytic steam-hydrocarbon process. This typically uses fossil fuels like natural gas or methane as an input, and produces CO2 as a byproduct alongside the H2. Compare with BEVs, where the energy used to power the motors can come from clean solar, wind, nuclear, or geothermal generation, without creating (as much) CO2 byproduct. (Yes, there are CO2 byproducts of producing power plants, but the goal is to minimize excess CO2 production, not eliminate it entirely.)

clouddrover 4y ago
> Remember that we're focused on mainly on climate impact here No. We're focused on whether or not hydrogen FCEVs are electric vehicles, which they are. > Compare with BEVs, where the energy used to power the motors can come from clean solar, wind, nuclear, or geothermal generation It can also come from coal and diesel and natural gas. None of this is relevant to whether or not FCEVs are electric vehicles.
- otterley 4y ago
  > No. We're focused on whether or not hydrogen FCEVs are electric vehicles, which they are. The root of this thread was about geopolitical issues, mining, and fossil fuels. It got sidetracked into a puerile squabble about what mechanism makes the wheels turn.
  - clouddrover 4y ago
    You've lost focus. FCEVs are electric vehicles. Admit to that and be happy.
    - otterley 4y ago
      I’ll stipulate that a FCV has an electric powertrain. But so what? An electric powertrain is orthogonal to the source of its fuel and its climate impact. That’s what matters to society. Let’s not ignore the forest for the trees here.
      - clouddrover 4y ago
        The "so what" is that you were making a false equivalence between diesel engines and hydrogen fuel cells. But you've made some progress so that's good.
        otterley 4y ago
        I bet you're a lot of fun at parties.
_hypx 4y ago
Hydrogen is literally identical to electricity in this regard. It is as green as it's energy source.