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I wonder why people say stuff like this. Are people writing code then just blindly shipping it to production? The process goes; 1. Write some code 2. Get AI

by AJRF 4y ago

I wonder why people say stuff like this. Are people writing code then just blindly shipping it to production? The process goes; 1. Write some code 2. Get AI assistance with some part 3. Check it's right, make changes 4. Write tests 5. Put up for code review 6. CI runs checks 7. Release Candidate 8. Release Testing There are many, many chances to catch errors. If you don't have the above in place, i'd focus on that first before using AI assistance tools.

latexr 4y ago
> I wonder why people say stuff like this. Are people writing code then just blindly shipping it to production? Yes, yes they are! HN is now inundated with examples and the situation is only going to get worse. People with zero understanding of code, who take hours to convert a single line from one language to another (and even then don’t care to understand the result) are shipping and selling software. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35128502 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35128502
- politician 4y ago
  This is no different from the NFT hustlers. Scam artists and get rich quick types exist everywhere.
  - latexr 4y ago
    I agree.¹ And you might agree that making scamming easier is an undesirable outcome. ¹ Last paragraph: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35133929 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35133929
- sumtechguy 4y ago
  People are already cut and pasting solutions off random webpages and stackoverflow. That they would grab stuff right out of chatgpt does not surprise me in the least. I would ask back 'why would this be any different this time?'
  - latexr 4y ago
    > random webpages and stackoverflow. Crucially, those have context around them. And as you navigate them more and more you develop an intuitive sense for what is trustworthy or not. Perhaps you even find a particularly good blog which you reference first every time you want to learn something from a particular language. Or in the case of Stack Overflow, your trust in an answer is enhanced by the discussion around it: the larger the conversation, the more confident you can be of its merits and limitations. When you get all your information from the same source and have no idea what it referenced, you lose the all the other cues regarding the validity, veracity, or usefulness of the information.
    - waboremo 4y ago
      >Crucially, those have context around them Often incorrect context, incredibly biased context (no you don't know what you want, here's a complete misdirection), or just plain outdated. So basically the same thing as ChatGPT. People who blindly copy and paste and ship are always going to do that. Everyone else isn't. It's really that simple.
      - latexr 4y ago
        > Often incorrect context, incredibly biased context And as you learn more from different sources, you get better at identifying them. > or just plain outdated Which you can plainly see by looking at the date of publication. In the case of Stack Overflow, it is common that popular questions have newer answers which invalidate old ones and replace them at the top. > People who blindly copy and paste and ship are always going to do that. Yes, they will. You seem to agree that is bad. So wouldn’t it follow that it is also bad that the pool of people doing that is now increasing at a much larger rate?
        waboremo 4y ago
        Sure, but do you have a solution to the problem that doesn't also hinder those who are using both StackOverflow and ChatGPT for "good"? Without a solution we're just whining about bad actors existing.
peoplefromibiza 4y ago
> Are people writing code then just blindly shipping it to production? Of course they do. Ship fast, break things, look cool, cash out, leave someone else to fix the mess you have created, it's the new black.
- AJRF 4y ago
  And AI makes this...worse?
  - layer8 4y ago
    Yes, it speeds it up considerably. More heaps of messy software produced much faster.
    - __MatrixMan__ 4y ago
      Doesn't that get the people who aren't doing due diligence fired faster?
      - bombela 4y ago
        I think not. Based on my experience working with people that have negative productivity continually being promoted and jumping from project to project leaving a mess behind. But hey they always deliver their non-functional crap in time, pleasing upper management short term.
digging 4y ago
> I wonder why people say stuff like this. Are people writing code then just blindly shipping it to production? Even if they're not, I find "scouring code I didn't write for potential errors of any magnitude" to be much harder than "writing code". I admit there's a sweet spot where errors would be easy to spot or where the AI is getting you unstuck, but it's not trustworthy enough at the moment for me to take the risk.

by AJRF 4y ago

latexr 4y ago

> I wonder why people say stuff like this. Are people writing code then just blindly shipping it to production? Yes, yes they are! HN is now inundated with examples and the situation is only going to get worse. People with zero understanding of code, who take hours to convert a single line from one language to another (and even then don’t care to understand the result) are shipping and selling software. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35128502 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35128502

politician 4y ago
This is no different from the NFT hustlers. Scam artists and get rich quick types exist everywhere.
- latexr 4y ago
  I agree.¹ And you might agree that making scamming easier is an undesirable outcome. ¹ Last paragraph: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35133929 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35133929
sumtechguy 4y ago
People are already cut and pasting solutions off random webpages and stackoverflow. That they would grab stuff right out of chatgpt does not surprise me in the least. I would ask back 'why would this be any different this time?'
- latexr 4y ago
  > random webpages and stackoverflow. Crucially, those have context around them. And as you navigate them more and more you develop an intuitive sense for what is trustworthy or not. Perhaps you even find a particularly good blog which you reference first every time you want to learn something from a particular language. Or in the case of Stack Overflow, your trust in an answer is enhanced by the discussion around it: the larger the conversation, the more confident you can be of its merits and limitations. When you get all your information from the same source and have no idea what it referenced, you lose the all the other cues regarding the validity, veracity, or usefulness of the information.
  - waboremo 4y ago
    >Crucially, those have context around them Often incorrect context, incredibly biased context (no you don't know what you want, here's a complete misdirection), or just plain outdated. So basically the same thing as ChatGPT. People who blindly copy and paste and ship are always going to do that. Everyone else isn't. It's really that simple.
    - latexr 4y ago
      > Often incorrect context, incredibly biased context And as you learn more from different sources, you get better at identifying them. > or just plain outdated Which you can plainly see by looking at the date of publication. In the case of Stack Overflow, it is common that popular questions have newer answers which invalidate old ones and replace them at the top. > People who blindly copy and paste and ship are always going to do that. Yes, they will. You seem to agree that is bad. So wouldn’t it follow that it is also bad that the pool of people doing that is now increasing at a much larger rate?
      - waboremo 4y ago
        Sure, but do you have a solution to the problem that doesn't also hinder those who are using both StackOverflow and ChatGPT for "good"? Without a solution we're just whining about bad actors existing.

peoplefromibiza 4y ago

> Are people writing code then just blindly shipping it to production? Of course they do. Ship fast, break things, look cool, cash out, leave someone else to fix the mess you have created, it's the new black.

AJRF 4y ago
And AI makes this...worse?
- layer8 4y ago
  Yes, it speeds it up considerably. More heaps of messy software produced much faster.
  - __MatrixMan__ 4y ago
    Doesn't that get the people who aren't doing due diligence fired faster?
    - bombela 4y ago
      I think not. Based on my experience working with people that have negative productivity continually being promoted and jumping from project to project leaving a mess behind. But hey they always deliver their non-functional crap in time, pleasing upper management short term.

digging 4y ago

> I wonder why people say stuff like this. Are people writing code then just blindly shipping it to production? Even if they're not, I find "scouring code I didn't write for potential errors of any magnitude" to be much harder than "writing code". I admit there's a sweet spot where errors would be easy to spot or where the AI is getting you unstuck, but it's not trustworthy enough at the moment for me to take the risk.