5 ms·

So the Pirate Bay is now a bastion of freedom that lets users in Syria and North Korea download the latest episode of Glee? (The current most popular torrent th

by Erwin 15y ago

So the Pirate Bay is now a bastion of freedom that lets users in Syria and North Korea download the latest episode of Glee? (The current most popular torrent there). I'm a little confused about what their greater noble political purpose is. To me it sounds like a place where you can get your TV shows in a more convenient way than waiting until they appear on channels you have, or download that movie you can't be bothered to pay $10-$20 to see. How about real civil disobedience? Have TBP require to put in your full name and picture and the reason why are you downloading the full Microsoft Office package. Put that full list on the front page on TBP, let the government see the tens thousands of people who refuse to follow the unjust copyright laws and are ready to go to prison for breaking them. Now you're making a statement. Or alternatively, produce your own independent content. Supposedly with today's technology it's easy and cheap. Wouldn't it be an amazing blow against this evil "MAFIAA" to one year from now go to TBP home page and see how the most downloaded file is not the latest Hollywood $250 million movie, but an independently produced short? If every user who tweeted against SOPA/ACTA would now tweet about that cool CC-licensed book/game/movie they just saw?

bad_user 15y ago
I don't get what your point is - do they need a greater and nobler political purpose other than giving access to whatever people want? Also, Microsoft Office is extremely expensive for people in third-world countries. Pointing people to free alternatives that aren't fully compatible and that have a different interface is not the answer. Microsoft's Office is required for most corporate documents and it is assumed when working computer knowledge is requested from employees. You're also suggesting that TBP should violate the privacy of its users. What do you think this would accomplish? And I'm sure the government would love having that list straight from the horse's mouth.
- DanBC 15y ago
  NO. If a product supplier prices themselves out of the market that's exactly the time when people should be pointing to Libre Office.
  - bad_user 15y ago
    Who are you to say that? When it comes to a defacto standard that's not a choice everybody can make.
- VMG 15y ago
  I don't get what your point is - do they need a greater and nobler political purpose other than giving access to whatever people want? They are misrepresenting themselves. Further, if they really had free speech and helping suppressed peoples in mind, they would remove most of their infringing content and provide a platform that can't be attacked on grounds of copyright infringement.
  - absentbird 15y ago
    Well Wikileaks didn't have copyright infringement claims against it and it has suffered massive blows to funding and traffic. TPB exists because people care about it. People care about it because it provides something relevant to them.
    - VMG 15y ago
      Then why does TPB mention Syria and North Korea at all? Why not be honest? "We exist because people want Call Of Duty Modern Warfare 3 for free and we can help them"
      - burgerbrain 15y ago
        "Then why does TPB mention Syria and North Korea at all?" Because they care about that.
      - Andrew_Quentin 15y ago
        Did you wonder why people from Syria and North Korea might actually want to visit that website? I found the figure mentioned of 100 visitors from North Korea daily pretty amazing to be honest. I checked my own site stats and though there are visitors from 183 countries not one is from North Korea. Pirate bay is not just movies. You can download plenty of books from it for free, university textbooks, philosophy, whatever.
diwank 15y ago
The point you make is really important but I think its relevance here may be doubtful. Civil disobedience at a massive scale is surely a compelling way of protest though you have to keep in mind that civil disobedience is about voluntary display of indignance by EVERYONE participating (read here as the users.) The Pirate Bay cannot take that decision on behalf of their users. It has to be an active and voluntary enagagement. Further, this TPB post stands for something more than mere access to paid content. It is essentially a protocol infused with freedom. No bar on content; no censorship; no policing. How one uses it is immaterial but as long as it exists, it offers people that freedom. Dissidents, political prisoners, protesters can always look to it as a last resort to share things. I think that coming out the way you describe is just not feasible for the TPB, the same way surrendering never made sense to Robin Hood.
lloeki 15y ago
> So the Pirate Bay is now a bastion of freedom that lets users in Syria and North Korea download the latest episode of Glee? - difference leads to unknown - unknown leads to fear - fear leads to hate This is the most basic, irrational reflex process from which emerges racism, and wars, and lots of purposeless suffering. Previously we were segregated by geography, long distances, creating islands of culture bound by the propagation times of information. We shattered that barrier. The Internet is the first place in the world since the birth of humanity where there can be a generation of people sharing the same culture all around the world. The fact that Iranians want to watch Glee may sound trivial, but I see it as a sign that people around the world want to unite. We should be able to watch shows, listen to music or access whatever medium by which culture transits from the other side of the world. I'm not condoning piracy but from artificial limitations like DVD zoning, digital distribution restrictions creating segregated stores (like iTunes Store) or Internet borderizing laws like SOPA really do not help at bringing people together. tl;dr: global culture sharing prevents wars.
burgerbrain 15y ago
Demanding that those who want change seek it by throwing themselves upon a pyre is a particularly annoying way of "covertly" wishing the status quo the best. Civil Disobedience is Not the following: The only way to seek change. The only legitimate way to seek change. Always the best way to seek change. Always effective at all.

by Erwin 15y ago

bad_user 15y ago

I don't get what your point is - do they need a greater and nobler political purpose other than giving access to whatever people want? Also, Microsoft Office is extremely expensive for people in third-world countries. Pointing people to free alternatives that aren't fully compatible and that have a different interface is not the answer. Microsoft's Office is required for most corporate documents and it is assumed when working computer knowledge is requested from employees. You're also suggesting that TBP should violate the privacy of its users. What do you think this would accomplish? And I'm sure the government would love having that list straight from the horse's mouth.

DanBC 15y ago
NO. If a product supplier prices themselves out of the market that's exactly the time when people should be pointing to Libre Office.
- bad_user 15y ago
  Who are you to say that? When it comes to a defacto standard that's not a choice everybody can make.
VMG 15y ago
I don't get what your point is - do they need a greater and nobler political purpose other than giving access to whatever people want? They are misrepresenting themselves. Further, if they really had free speech and helping suppressed peoples in mind, they would remove most of their infringing content and provide a platform that can't be attacked on grounds of copyright infringement.
- absentbird 15y ago
  Well Wikileaks didn't have copyright infringement claims against it and it has suffered massive blows to funding and traffic. TPB exists because people care about it. People care about it because it provides something relevant to them.
  - VMG 15y ago
    Then why does TPB mention Syria and North Korea at all? Why not be honest? "We exist because people want Call Of Duty Modern Warfare 3 for free and we can help them"
    - burgerbrain 15y ago
      "Then why does TPB mention Syria and North Korea at all?" Because they care about that.
    - Andrew_Quentin 15y ago
      Did you wonder why people from Syria and North Korea might actually want to visit that website? I found the figure mentioned of 100 visitors from North Korea daily pretty amazing to be honest. I checked my own site stats and though there are visitors from 183 countries not one is from North Korea. Pirate bay is not just movies. You can download plenty of books from it for free, university textbooks, philosophy, whatever.

diwank 15y ago

The point you make is really important but I think its relevance here may be doubtful. Civil disobedience at a massive scale is surely a compelling way of protest though you have to keep in mind that civil disobedience is about voluntary display of indignance by EVERYONE participating (read here as the users.) The Pirate Bay cannot take that decision on behalf of their users. It has to be an active and voluntary enagagement. Further, this TPB post stands for something more than mere access to paid content. It is essentially a protocol infused with freedom. No bar on content; no censorship; no policing. How one uses it is immaterial but as long as it exists, it offers people that freedom. Dissidents, political prisoners, protesters can always look to it as a last resort to share things. I think that coming out the way you describe is just not feasible for the TPB, the same way surrendering never made sense to Robin Hood.

lloeki 15y ago

> So the Pirate Bay is now a bastion of freedom that lets users in Syria and North Korea download the latest episode of Glee? - difference leads to unknown - unknown leads to fear - fear leads to hate This is the most basic, irrational reflex process from which emerges racism, and wars, and lots of purposeless suffering. Previously we were segregated by geography, long distances, creating islands of culture bound by the propagation times of information. We shattered that barrier. The Internet is the first place in the world since the birth of humanity where there can be a generation of people sharing the same culture all around the world. The fact that Iranians want to watch Glee may sound trivial, but I see it as a sign that people around the world want to unite. We should be able to watch shows, listen to music or access whatever medium by which culture transits from the other side of the world. I'm not condoning piracy but from artificial limitations like DVD zoning, digital distribution restrictions creating segregated stores (like iTunes Store) or Internet borderizing laws like SOPA really do not help at bringing people together. tl;dr: global culture sharing prevents wars.

burgerbrain 15y ago

Demanding that those who want change seek it by throwing themselves upon a pyre is a particularly annoying way of "covertly" wishing the status quo the best. Civil Disobedience is Not the following: The only way to seek change. The only legitimate way to seek change. Always the best way to seek change. Always effective at all.