7 ms·

Windows 12 Plans Reveal a Bold Redesign, Tighter Security, AI-Powered Features

28 points by nateb2022 4y ago

yutijke 4y ago
They should have just stopped at Windows 10. Maybe even made it such at a license is for 5 years and you'll need to renew at the end of the period if you want updates. With something like an OS I do not want bold redesigns every other year. A bold "about the same design" would be very nice.
- zhfliz 4y ago
  requiring a paid license for updates just leads to people not installing security updates.
  - yutijke 4y ago
    I know. This is a hard problem. Most companies just make it a subscription, but I wish it wasn't that way since you end up not owning the the software which you bought.
Rodeoclash 4y ago
I'm still on Windows 10 and the last time I opened it, I had an image of garlic in the search widget of the task bar. Clicking this lead me to a page about a wild garlic festival in Germany. As far as I'm concerned, whoever is running Windows has lost their minds. I have no idea why someone considers the wild garlic festival to be important enough to put directly on my desktop. I'm not gaming much at the moment so the last reason to stay on Windows has gone. It's really just down to laziness which is keeping me on it.
- carrolldunham 4y ago
  It's fine, because there's two groups of people - people who know when you install it to turn off Cortana and online stuff, and people who don't know that, who, it turns out also tend to think "ooh, a garlic festival?" "ooh, prince harry did what?!" instead of "what is this trash in my start"
- deafpolygon 4y ago
  I've turned the taskbar search and cortana off, so I don't see it. But I agree, it's ridiculous.
- fphhotchips 4y ago
  > Clicking this lead me to a page about a wild garlic festival in Germany. And you learned a little something that you didn't know before. It cost you nothing. You got a little drawing of garlic in your search bar. That cost you nothing too. I personally enjoy the little search bar illustrations and the rotating login screen background with the "did you know" style button. It's nice. Not everything has to be all serious all the time.
  - rkagerer 4y ago
    It cost an incredibly valuable reource: his attention.
    - fphhotchips 4y ago
      No, he donated that. He could have chosen to simply ignore the icon, as thousands of others do daily.
      - nailer 4y ago
        Would you ignore random garlic in your OS?
        fphhotchips 4y ago
        Yes. I didn't ignore today's because this conversation had it front-of-mind and I'm curious, but it seems like for a long time it was some kind of beach scene and I have no idea what that was about. Once you know "this is just a little curiosity button", it's easy enough to ignore if you're not into that. (Today's is in reference to van Gogh's 170th birthday, which is a nice little "oh!" moment, but not one I clicked through to see more)
        slowmovintarget 4y ago
        This is Microsoft trying to drive usage for Edge by adding a Google widget into Windows. None of those clickable features in the Taskbar open your default browser, they all open Edge.
deafpolygon 4y ago
What the hell? // sorry for the lack of text, I really have no words... I say this as someone who genuinely likes Win 11. Win12 is shaping up to be a huge wtf, if any of it is true.
DethNinja 4y ago
I feel like Windows is a lost cause with current capabilities of Proton and Wine on Linux. It will be possible to run almost all Windows software on Linux with even better security probably in couple of years.
- rkagerer 4y ago
  I wish SolidWorks was included in that.
- herbst 4y ago
  Hey I thought exactly that 15 years ago when wine got a major update. I never looked back :)
- ajb 4y ago
  I wish, but Wine is not a kernel. My one use case for Windows is my Fujitsu scan snap, because the SW is better than the Linux scanning SW which is rather basic. But it seems like wine will never support it because it can't run device drivers.
  - kitsunesoba 4y ago
    This use case seems like it’d be taken care of pretty well by a VM running the requisite version of Windows, since VMs have USB passthrough. Years ago when Windows-only peripherals were more common I did this on my macs.
    - ajb 4y ago
      Yes, I used to have a VM of Windows, at one point they were trying to attract devs and sold a VM licence for $25. But it stopped working when I changed computers (I think that was outside the terms) and now a legitimate VM licence is much more unless you go for a dodgy OEM key. Coincidentally I just tried again today and the scanning story on Ubuntu has improved a bit . Setup is still a bitch but once it's there it's almost as productive as scanning on windows.
- pjmlp 4y ago
hulitu 4y ago
> Tighter Security Haha, just like Win 98: Most secure Windows ever. And in the mean time the only security it offers is against the user. Ransomware runs just fine.
pyuser583 4y ago
Windows is for gaming - and that’s it.
- herbst 4y ago
  Except that when games actually get a native Linux release they more often than not run even more performant. Or older games that run better in proton/wine than natively because you can apply patches and modern windows doesn't properly support old windows. I am not saying Linux is a gaming OS. But you can passtrough your grafics card to a VM so there is literally no reason to run native Windows for gaming for years now. Except windows is the thing you like, I don't judge.
  - imbnwa 4y ago
    >I am not saying Linux is a gaming OS. But you can passtrough your grafics card to a VM so there is literally no reason to run native Windows for gaming for years now. How reliable/trivial/performant is that, conceding that's its possible, e.g. will I get equal results running Cyberpunk 2077 on a 4090 at 4K with RT as on Windows?
    - herbst 4y ago
      It should be. It's no magic, 10 years ago you needed a little bit of Linux skills to get it off but it was well documented. Pretty sure it got easier in that time as well
accrual 4y ago
It's interesting to see the "leaked" screenshot of Windows 12: https://www.techradar.com/news/leaked-screenshot-could-be-an-early-glimpse-of-the-windows-12-desktop https://www.techradar.com/news/leaked-screenshot-could-be-an... If it's real, it looks similar to iPadOS. Even with the less than successful endeavors of WinRT and Windows Phone (Phone was actually pretty cool), I feel Microsoft has never truly lost their desire to converge on a single desktop environment for desktop and mobile. We see this at Apple too though - there's a lot of dismay over macOS converging with iOS and iPadOS in recent releases. What are the key reasons for it? More unified codebase? Just to make everything look the same? I will always see desktops and mobile as separate tools that should have separate UIs, so these kinds of changes bum me out.
- MiddleEndian 4y ago
  I don't understand Microsoft's new obsession with centering the taskbar program icons. Consistent placement of core programs whether they're open or not, whether lesser-used programs are open or not, is a fantastic use of muscle memory.
  - pjmlp 4y ago
    Easy, macOS and ChromeOS docks.
  - suby 4y ago
    Floating the panel with spacing for the edges also potentially makes clicking on icons more obnoxious, because instead of flinging your mouse down at high velocity you now need to make sure it stops before the very edge. I say potentially because maybe they'll make the hitbox extend to the bottom edge. Knowing Microsoft though, I doubt it. It also is unnecessarily using space that I'd rather have for apps (not everyone has a high resolution monitor) and to my eye looks rather ugly. Definitely agree with you on the criticism of centered icons too, the position of items is now dynamic depending on how many icons are open which as you say is bad for muscle memory. There should be user studies being continuously done to converge on the best UI. A/B test the hell out of it and make it a science. Instead I get the feeling that it's ad-hoc with designers wanting to both leave a mark and copy macOS.
mike_d 4y ago
The most irritating thing about Windows 11, and what it looks like they are doing with Windows 12 is that they are trying to compete with iPad OS not MacOS. Microsoft seems to have just abandoned the idea of a desktop operating system and is just assuming everything is a tablet or has a touch screen going forward. It is an absolutely bonkers move for the company that built its Windows and Office empire off of the enterprise desktop.
- LegitShady 4y ago
  its also exactly the same stupid decision they made that ruined windows 8 - and they're doing it again. I haven't updated to windows 11 on my machines and I wont until I have to, and I will investigate alternatives. Some absolutely stupid design decisions and UI limitations that make no sense and should be optional,
- pjmlp 4y ago
  Additionally, most likely they will bork yet again the development experience. For those losing count, Windows 8 introduced WinRT with three UI models (phone/tablet/desktop), Windows 8.1 introduced UAP and reduced the UI models to 2 (phone/tablet and desktop), Windows 10 introduced UWP and merged all UI models into a universal one (U in UWP). .NET Native and C++/CX were introduced as a reboot of the Windows platform where COM takes again the center stage, as if .NET as such never happened and we got the evolution of VB 6 instead. Due to lack of update, and multiple rewrites, they came up with WinUI 3.0 and WinAppSDK, which dropped .NET Native and C++/CX, .NET and C++/WinRT are still lacking versus the former in Visual Studio tooling for WinUI development, WinUI 3.0 is still years behind UWP features, many key people that used to be in the community calls have either left Microsoft, or moved into Azure. Now they are rebooting it yet again? Good luck convincing those of us that had enough from this mismanagement.
  - yread 4y ago
    I just still write WinForms. It looks like crap, works everywhere and everyone knows how to use it
pjmlp 4y ago
Who cares, anyone remembers Windows One Core? https://blogs.windows.com/windowsdeveloper/2015/03/02/a-first-look-at-the-windows-10-universal-app-platform/ https://blogs.windows.com/windowsdeveloper/2015/03/02/a-firs... The difference now is that .NET Native and C++/CX are gone, and WinUI 3.0 / WinAppSDK, still aren't at feature parity level, lack a designer, form validation, maps, and plenty of other stuff. They burned most of the bridges with hardcore UWP advocates (like myself), so who do they expect will care for Windows 12 besides WinDev themselves?
chadlavi 4y ago
Looking more and more like a linux desktop distro that (poorly) ripped off most of its ideas from OS X.
- imbnwa 4y ago
  Hilarious that the GNOME boys got bit by the bug first, and yet, neither they nor Microsoft will get it right
  - deafpolygon 4y ago
    Not even Apple gets it right.
herbst 4y ago
More ads too? The world definitely needs more wasted screen space
- hulitu 4y ago
  They have a "solution" for that: window border 0 px, hidden scrollbar, hidden cursor, GUI elements in titlebar.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
nly 4y ago
When I saw the headline my first thought was "What!? They're skipping version 11!?". Then, after far too many seconds, I remembered that Windows 11 does in fact exist and I'd just blotted the whole thing out of memory as "don't care". And this sums up my attitude to Windows now.
- iKlsR 4y ago
  At risk of being a meme comment... https://www.pdiniz.com/content/images/2015/04/windows-bad-good-cycle.jpg https://www.pdiniz.com/content/images/2015/04/windows-bad-go... XP : Good | Vista : Bad | 7 : Good | 8 : Bad | 10 : Good | 11 : Bad | 12 : Good??
justinclift 4y ago
Important highlights from the planning meeting: * https://youtu.be/KpPE85Jogjw?t=17 https://youtu.be/KpPE85Jogjw?t=17
qikInNdOutReply 4y ago
The AI powered features does not even include amateur pipes. You could really build application chains now even as a total amateur. As in source application (internet browser) with AI commands to code ("get me pictures of spiderman"), pipe them to photoshop ("color grade them to black & white and save them"), then put them in an ouput folder. The pipes and stream automation, previously reserved to linux devs, could now become a normal user experience, encapsulated by prompts and gui application pipes. But thats not were they want to go. So others will. Once any other OS starts to have that (linux or macos) productivity there will skyrocket, and its the end of days for windows.
- slowmovintarget 4y ago
  That really ought to be something Cortana (or Siri) can do.
random_upvoter 4y ago
You know what would be cool? The "Cancelling a large file copy doesn't freeze my explorer for 10 minutes" update. I've been waiting since Windows XP.
mrjin 4y ago
Since Windows 10, updates are just like Russian roulettes, you will never know what they are going to fix or break. Making it worse, you don't have control when to update any more. I still remember what on the face one of my colleague demoing to our big boss, Windows decided it's time to update and rebooted showing 200+ updates to be installed and over 2 hours to go. I seem to be lucky enough to dodging whole disk being wiped by an update, but still I experienced more than enough nuisances. The most significant ones were UI changes. Those were just changes to change without any obvious benefits but broke lots, lots of things. Put all those small little annoying bugs, I noticed those core utilities once rock solid started to corrupt. For Windows 10, once I had to manually set the IP address as I had to change some settings on one of my routers in bridge mode, it turned out all 3 UIs (traditional GUI, new metro UI and command line) were broken. Eventually I had to combine two of them to get the job done. Also, the disk management utilities were broken too while I was trying to clean wipe one of my boot thumb drives for something else, which forced me to do it in Linux. For Windows 11, it's even worse. It first silently updated one of my computers to it, I did not like those huge buttons in the task bar, so changed the registry but the alignment was wrong, so I rolled it back. Soon I bought a new surface pro for my kid which came with 11. It looked okay but less than one week later, a update was installed, and the external monitor started to blink. So I uninstalled the update, but the whole system was screwed up, so I had to downgrade to Windows 10. A couple of months later, I bought another laptop came with 11 too. It was okay until yesterday after another update. Edge was slowed down so much that can take 30s just to switch to another tab. Tried all different settings, uninstalled the update, none worked. I virtually figured out why just minutes ago. So all the URL screening sh*ts which were previously turned off now back on. Once I turned off those, it finally returned normal. Probably it's time for me to ditch Windows once and for all after over two decades.
simonblack 4y ago
Windows reminds me of Detroit's cars in the 1950s. "Let's change everything around, that way we can tout it as 'different and new' even though it's still the same old crap under the bonnet."

28 points by nateb2022 4y ago

They should have just stopped at Windows 10. Maybe even made it such at a license is for 5 years and you'll need to renew at the end of the period if you want updates. With something like an OS I do not want bold redesigns every other year. A bold "about the same design" would be very nice.

zhfliz 4y ago
requiring a paid license for updates just leads to people not installing security updates.
- yutijke 4y ago
  I know. This is a hard problem. Most companies just make it a subscription, but I wish it wasn't that way since you end up not owning the the software which you bought.

Rodeoclash 4y ago

I'm still on Windows 10 and the last time I opened it, I had an image of garlic in the search widget of the task bar. Clicking this lead me to a page about a wild garlic festival in Germany. As far as I'm concerned, whoever is running Windows has lost their minds. I have no idea why someone considers the wild garlic festival to be important enough to put directly on my desktop. I'm not gaming much at the moment so the last reason to stay on Windows has gone. It's really just down to laziness which is keeping me on it.

carrolldunham 4y ago
It's fine, because there's two groups of people - people who know when you install it to turn off Cortana and online stuff, and people who don't know that, who, it turns out also tend to think "ooh, a garlic festival?" "ooh, prince harry did what?!" instead of "what is this trash in my start"
deafpolygon 4y ago
I've turned the taskbar search and cortana off, so I don't see it. But I agree, it's ridiculous.
fphhotchips 4y ago
> Clicking this lead me to a page about a wild garlic festival in Germany. And you learned a little something that you didn't know before. It cost you nothing. You got a little drawing of garlic in your search bar. That cost you nothing too. I personally enjoy the little search bar illustrations and the rotating login screen background with the "did you know" style button. It's nice. Not everything has to be all serious all the time.
- rkagerer 4y ago
  It cost an incredibly valuable reource: his attention.
  - fphhotchips 4y ago
    No, he donated that. He could have chosen to simply ignore the icon, as thousands of others do daily.
    - nailer 4y ago
      Would you ignore random garlic in your OS?
      - fphhotchips 4y ago
        Yes. I didn't ignore today's because this conversation had it front-of-mind and I'm curious, but it seems like for a long time it was some kind of beach scene and I have no idea what that was about. Once you know "this is just a little curiosity button", it's easy enough to ignore if you're not into that. (Today's is in reference to van Gogh's 170th birthday, which is a nice little "oh!" moment, but not one I clicked through to see more)
        slowmovintarget 4y ago
        This is Microsoft trying to drive usage for Edge by adding a Google widget into Windows. None of those clickable features in the Taskbar open your default browser, they all open Edge.

deafpolygon 4y ago

What the hell? // sorry for the lack of text, I really have no words... I say this as someone who genuinely likes Win 11. Win12 is shaping up to be a huge wtf, if any of it is true.

DethNinja 4y ago

I feel like Windows is a lost cause with current capabilities of Proton and Wine on Linux. It will be possible to run almost all Windows software on Linux with even better security probably in couple of years.

rkagerer 4y ago
I wish SolidWorks was included in that.
herbst 4y ago
Hey I thought exactly that 15 years ago when wine got a major update. I never looked back :)
ajb 4y ago
I wish, but Wine is not a kernel. My one use case for Windows is my Fujitsu scan snap, because the SW is better than the Linux scanning SW which is rather basic. But it seems like wine will never support it because it can't run device drivers.
- kitsunesoba 4y ago
  This use case seems like it’d be taken care of pretty well by a VM running the requisite version of Windows, since VMs have USB passthrough. Years ago when Windows-only peripherals were more common I did this on my macs.
  - ajb 4y ago
    Yes, I used to have a VM of Windows, at one point they were trying to attract devs and sold a VM licence for $25. But it stopped working when I changed computers (I think that was outside the terms) and now a legitimate VM licence is much more unless you go for a dodgy OEM key. Coincidentally I just tried again today and the scanning story on Ubuntu has improved a bit . Setup is still a bitch but once it's there it's almost as productive as scanning on windows.
pjmlp 4y ago

hulitu 4y ago

> Tighter Security Haha, just like Win 98: Most secure Windows ever. And in the mean time the only security it offers is against the user. Ransomware runs just fine.

pyuser583 4y ago

Windows is for gaming - and that’s it.

herbst 4y ago
Except that when games actually get a native Linux release they more often than not run even more performant. Or older games that run better in proton/wine than natively because you can apply patches and modern windows doesn't properly support old windows. I am not saying Linux is a gaming OS. But you can passtrough your grafics card to a VM so there is literally no reason to run native Windows for gaming for years now. Except windows is the thing you like, I don't judge.
- imbnwa 4y ago
  >I am not saying Linux is a gaming OS. But you can passtrough your grafics card to a VM so there is literally no reason to run native Windows for gaming for years now. How reliable/trivial/performant is that, conceding that's its possible, e.g. will I get equal results running Cyberpunk 2077 on a 4090 at 4K with RT as on Windows?
  - herbst 4y ago
    It should be. It's no magic, 10 years ago you needed a little bit of Linux skills to get it off but it was well documented. Pretty sure it got easier in that time as well

accrual 4y ago

It's interesting to see the "leaked" screenshot of Windows 12: https://www.techradar.com/news/leaked-screenshot-could-be-an-early-glimpse-of-the-windows-12-desktop https://www.techradar.com/news/leaked-screenshot-could-be-an... If it's real, it looks similar to iPadOS. Even with the less than successful endeavors of WinRT and Windows Phone (Phone was actually pretty cool), I feel Microsoft has never truly lost their desire to converge on a single desktop environment for desktop and mobile. We see this at Apple too though - there's a lot of dismay over macOS converging with iOS and iPadOS in recent releases. What are the key reasons for it? More unified codebase? Just to make everything look the same? I will always see desktops and mobile as separate tools that should have separate UIs, so these kinds of changes bum me out.

MiddleEndian 4y ago
I don't understand Microsoft's new obsession with centering the taskbar program icons. Consistent placement of core programs whether they're open or not, whether lesser-used programs are open or not, is a fantastic use of muscle memory.
- pjmlp 4y ago
  Easy, macOS and ChromeOS docks.
- suby 4y ago
  Floating the panel with spacing for the edges also potentially makes clicking on icons more obnoxious, because instead of flinging your mouse down at high velocity you now need to make sure it stops before the very edge. I say potentially because maybe they'll make the hitbox extend to the bottom edge. Knowing Microsoft though, I doubt it. It also is unnecessarily using space that I'd rather have for apps (not everyone has a high resolution monitor) and to my eye looks rather ugly. Definitely agree with you on the criticism of centered icons too, the position of items is now dynamic depending on how many icons are open which as you say is bad for muscle memory. There should be user studies being continuously done to converge on the best UI. A/B test the hell out of it and make it a science. Instead I get the feeling that it's ad-hoc with designers wanting to both leave a mark and copy macOS.

mike_d 4y ago

The most irritating thing about Windows 11, and what it looks like they are doing with Windows 12 is that they are trying to compete with iPad OS not MacOS. Microsoft seems to have just abandoned the idea of a desktop operating system and is just assuming everything is a tablet or has a touch screen going forward. It is an absolutely bonkers move for the company that built its Windows and Office empire off of the enterprise desktop.

LegitShady 4y ago
its also exactly the same stupid decision they made that ruined windows 8 - and they're doing it again. I haven't updated to windows 11 on my machines and I wont until I have to, and I will investigate alternatives. Some absolutely stupid design decisions and UI limitations that make no sense and should be optional,
pjmlp 4y ago
Additionally, most likely they will bork yet again the development experience. For those losing count, Windows 8 introduced WinRT with three UI models (phone/tablet/desktop), Windows 8.1 introduced UAP and reduced the UI models to 2 (phone/tablet and desktop), Windows 10 introduced UWP and merged all UI models into a universal one (U in UWP). .NET Native and C++/CX were introduced as a reboot of the Windows platform where COM takes again the center stage, as if .NET as such never happened and we got the evolution of VB 6 instead. Due to lack of update, and multiple rewrites, they came up with WinUI 3.0 and WinAppSDK, which dropped .NET Native and C++/CX, .NET and C++/WinRT are still lacking versus the former in Visual Studio tooling for WinUI development, WinUI 3.0 is still years behind UWP features, many key people that used to be in the community calls have either left Microsoft, or moved into Azure. Now they are rebooting it yet again? Good luck convincing those of us that had enough from this mismanagement.
- yread 4y ago
  I just still write WinForms. It looks like crap, works everywhere and everyone knows how to use it

pjmlp 4y ago

Who cares, anyone remembers Windows One Core? https://blogs.windows.com/windowsdeveloper/2015/03/02/a-first-look-at-the-windows-10-universal-app-platform/ https://blogs.windows.com/windowsdeveloper/2015/03/02/a-firs... The difference now is that .NET Native and C++/CX are gone, and WinUI 3.0 / WinAppSDK, still aren't at feature parity level, lack a designer, form validation, maps, and plenty of other stuff. They burned most of the bridges with hardcore UWP advocates (like myself), so who do they expect will care for Windows 12 besides WinDev themselves?

chadlavi 4y ago

Looking more and more like a linux desktop distro that (poorly) ripped off most of its ideas from OS X.

imbnwa 4y ago
Hilarious that the GNOME boys got bit by the bug first, and yet, neither they nor Microsoft will get it right
- deafpolygon 4y ago
  Not even Apple gets it right.

herbst 4y ago

More ads too? The world definitely needs more wasted screen space

hulitu 4y ago
They have a "solution" for that: window border 0 px, hidden scrollbar, hidden cursor, GUI elements in titlebar.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

nly 4y ago

When I saw the headline my first thought was "What!? They're skipping version 11!?". Then, after far too many seconds, I remembered that Windows 11 does in fact exist and I'd just blotted the whole thing out of memory as "don't care". And this sums up my attitude to Windows now.

iKlsR 4y ago
At risk of being a meme comment... https://www.pdiniz.com/content/images/2015/04/windows-bad-good-cycle.jpg https://www.pdiniz.com/content/images/2015/04/windows-bad-go... XP : Good | Vista : Bad | 7 : Good | 8 : Bad | 10 : Good | 11 : Bad | 12 : Good??

justinclift 4y ago

Important highlights from the planning meeting: * https://youtu.be/KpPE85Jogjw?t=17 https://youtu.be/KpPE85Jogjw?t=17

qikInNdOutReply 4y ago

The AI powered features does not even include amateur pipes. You could really build application chains now even as a total amateur. As in source application (internet browser) with AI commands to code ("get me pictures of spiderman"), pipe them to photoshop ("color grade them to black & white and save them"), then put them in an ouput folder. The pipes and stream automation, previously reserved to linux devs, could now become a normal user experience, encapsulated by prompts and gui application pipes. But thats not were they want to go. So others will. Once any other OS starts to have that (linux or macos) productivity there will skyrocket, and its the end of days for windows.

slowmovintarget 4y ago
That really ought to be something Cortana (or Siri) can do.

random_upvoter 4y ago

You know what would be cool? The "Cancelling a large file copy doesn't freeze my explorer for 10 minutes" update. I've been waiting since Windows XP.

mrjin 4y ago

Since Windows 10, updates are just like Russian roulettes, you will never know what they are going to fix or break. Making it worse, you don't have control when to update any more. I still remember what on the face one of my colleague demoing to our big boss, Windows decided it's time to update and rebooted showing 200+ updates to be installed and over 2 hours to go. I seem to be lucky enough to dodging whole disk being wiped by an update, but still I experienced more than enough nuisances. The most significant ones were UI changes. Those were just changes to change without any obvious benefits but broke lots, lots of things. Put all those small little annoying bugs, I noticed those core utilities once rock solid started to corrupt. For Windows 10, once I had to manually set the IP address as I had to change some settings on one of my routers in bridge mode, it turned out all 3 UIs (traditional GUI, new metro UI and command line) were broken. Eventually I had to combine two of them to get the job done. Also, the disk management utilities were broken too while I was trying to clean wipe one of my boot thumb drives for something else, which forced me to do it in Linux. For Windows 11, it's even worse. It first silently updated one of my computers to it, I did not like those huge buttons in the task bar, so changed the registry but the alignment was wrong, so I rolled it back. Soon I bought a new surface pro for my kid which came with 11. It looked okay but less than one week later, a update was installed, and the external monitor started to blink. So I uninstalled the update, but the whole system was screwed up, so I had to downgrade to Windows 10. A couple of months later, I bought another laptop came with 11 too. It was okay until yesterday after another update. Edge was slowed down so much that can take 30s just to switch to another tab. Tried all different settings, uninstalled the update, none worked. I virtually figured out why just minutes ago. So all the URL screening sh*ts which were previously turned off now back on. Once I turned off those, it finally returned normal. Probably it's time for me to ditch Windows once and for all after over two decades.

simonblack 4y ago

Windows reminds me of Detroit's cars in the 1950s. "Let's change everything around, that way we can tout it as 'different and new' even though it's still the same old crap under the bonnet."