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Now you're moving the goal posts from automatic plausible image generation to full on general AI and saying 'some day' it could happen. This is not the same di

Now you're moving the goal posts from automatic plausible image generation to full on general AI and saying 'some day' it could happen. This is not the same discussion.

satvikpendem 4y ago
It doesn't really have to be general AI to iterate on the same loop as humans, as the parent mentions. Using words like "(n)ever" should be restricted to things that we've proven to be unable to be done, like the laws of mathematics or physics, not stuff that we already see is feasible today (ie, human and animal minds and physical movement). It's not a question of "some day," it's more a question of which philosophical belief one holds to make them think it could or couldn't happen. Like I mentioned, some people simply believe humans are somehow better than machines or animals, and based on what we've seen so far, that's simply not the case.
- CyberDildonics 4y ago
  I'm not even sure what you are actually trying to say at this point. At first you seemed to be insinuating that AI will "upend vfx" because a lot fof movies are "like transformers" and now you're saying "never is a long time and what if AI becomes like a human"
  - satvikpendem 4y ago
    Sorry, I was mainly responding to the criticism that many non-technical people say, "AI will never come for our jobs," discounting the rate of change that technology generally experiences over and above other types of human endeavors. I'm just frustrated by people thinking they and their job are somehow special and laying back while real change happens all around them. My points are a bit disjointed, I could have been clearer, sorry about that.
    - CyberDildonics 4y ago
      I'm just frustrated by people thinking they and their job are somehow special and laying back while real change happens all around them. What makes you think industrial light and magic or anyone in the vfx thinks this way? It has been one of the most competitive and rapidly changing industries in the last 40 years.
      - DrewADesign 4y ago
        I'd guess it's an abject lack of knowledge about the field, and a deep-seated insecurity that prevents him from feeling good about himself if he doesn't feel like he's superior to someone else.
    - DrewADesign 4y ago
      Your points were perfectly portrayed. The problem was that they are extrapolations based on assumptions born from idle musings and suppositions. AI is already used heavily in VFX and it's use is expanding. Tech artists in VFX, games , etc are not non-technical people. Much, if not most of any given job involves coding in Python, C++, or a handful of proprietary languages. I was a full-time developer for ten years and I know one with a masters in computer science in addition to an MFA. If you knew things like that, or anything about the way professional VFX was done, the logistics of how movies get made, what intellectually and creatively goes into creating movie scenes, the involved piplines and their purposes, both technical and artistic, or any of the other critical bits of knowledge needed to talk about how this stuff actually works, then your comments would have been a lot better. If that wasn't obnoxious enough by itself, it manifests in the urge rub your perceived insecurity of people's careers in their faces. No matter how insanely ill-informed your statements are, that's just a messed up thing to do. It's not normal. Man. Get some help.
      - satvikpendem 4y ago
        Okay, let's change my statement to: many technical people (or just people with jobs in general) say that AI won't come for our jobs, using words like "n/ever" as you have done, that "that's just not something machines will be able to do themselves. Ever. No machine will be able to say 'this is the most emotionally impactful texture and drape for that superhero's cape in this scene.'". My point is not on non-technical people particularly, it's on the latter part of my statement, that people in general think that they are somehow special and will be in for quite a rude surprise when AI and automation eventually does do what they thought was was only in the realm of mere humans. People in general underestimate the end to end automation that will occur. You do too, seeing as you've said what I've quoted above. You say AI is heavily used, great, but don't be surprised when AI is so heavily used that it becomes the only thing used, eventually.

Now you're moving the goal posts from automatic plausible image generation to full on general AI and saying 'some day' it could happen. This is not the same discussion.

satvikpendem 4y ago

It doesn't really have to be general AI to iterate on the same loop as humans, as the parent mentions. Using words like "(n)ever" should be restricted to things that we've proven to be unable to be done, like the laws of mathematics or physics, not stuff that we already see is feasible today (ie, human and animal minds and physical movement). It's not a question of "some day," it's more a question of which philosophical belief one holds to make them think it could or couldn't happen. Like I mentioned, some people simply believe humans are somehow better than machines or animals, and based on what we've seen so far, that's simply not the case.

CyberDildonics 4y ago
I'm not even sure what you are actually trying to say at this point. At first you seemed to be insinuating that AI will "upend vfx" because a lot fof movies are "like transformers" and now you're saying "never is a long time and what if AI becomes like a human"
- satvikpendem 4y ago
  Sorry, I was mainly responding to the criticism that many non-technical people say, "AI will never come for our jobs," discounting the rate of change that technology generally experiences over and above other types of human endeavors. I'm just frustrated by people thinking they and their job are somehow special and laying back while real change happens all around them. My points are a bit disjointed, I could have been clearer, sorry about that.
  - CyberDildonics 4y ago
    I'm just frustrated by people thinking they and their job are somehow special and laying back while real change happens all around them. What makes you think industrial light and magic or anyone in the vfx thinks this way? It has been one of the most competitive and rapidly changing industries in the last 40 years.
    - DrewADesign 4y ago
      I'd guess it's an abject lack of knowledge about the field, and a deep-seated insecurity that prevents him from feeling good about himself if he doesn't feel like he's superior to someone else.
  - DrewADesign 4y ago
    Your points were perfectly portrayed. The problem was that they are extrapolations based on assumptions born from idle musings and suppositions. AI is already used heavily in VFX and it's use is expanding. Tech artists in VFX, games , etc are not non-technical people. Much, if not most of any given job involves coding in Python, C++, or a handful of proprietary languages. I was a full-time developer for ten years and I know one with a masters in computer science in addition to an MFA. If you knew things like that, or anything about the way professional VFX was done, the logistics of how movies get made, what intellectually and creatively goes into creating movie scenes, the involved piplines and their purposes, both technical and artistic, or any of the other critical bits of knowledge needed to talk about how this stuff actually works, then your comments would have been a lot better. If that wasn't obnoxious enough by itself, it manifests in the urge rub your perceived insecurity of people's careers in their faces. No matter how insanely ill-informed your statements are, that's just a messed up thing to do. It's not normal. Man. Get some help.
    - satvikpendem 4y ago
      Okay, let's change my statement to: many technical people (or just people with jobs in general) say that AI won't come for our jobs, using words like "n/ever" as you have done, that "that's just not something machines will be able to do themselves. Ever. No machine will be able to say 'this is the most emotionally impactful texture and drape for that superhero's cape in this scene.'". My point is not on non-technical people particularly, it's on the latter part of my statement, that people in general think that they are somehow special and will be in for quite a rude surprise when AI and automation eventually does do what they thought was was only in the realm of mere humans. People in general underestimate the end to end automation that will occur. You do too, seeing as you've said what I've quoted above. You say AI is heavily used, great, but don't be surprised when AI is so heavily used that it becomes the only thing used, eventually.