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Indeed. I always thought they deferred the launch of any new model after X1C in order to take the true "just works" crown back (with the hopes of it would be so

Indeed. I always thought they deferred the launch of any new model after X1C in order to take the true "just works" crown back (with the hopes of it would be something like Intel/AMD feuds where the monopoly had finally came to an end and customers can finally see some real competition). But apparently it is just a classic Prusa printer with better parts but still a very very high price to usability ratio (compared to Bambu Lab P1P or X1).

f38zf5vdt 4y ago
It's a proprietary versus open source argument. You can build a mk4 clone for much less than the price of a Prusa-branded one, as everything is open source. The higher price tag is like a donation to open source. Prusa also makes the open source XL if you want an CoreXY model, or you could go with a Voron which is also open source.
- treesciencebot 4y ago
  > It's a proprietary versus open source argument. You can build a mk4 clone for much less than the price of a Prusa-branded one, as everything is open source. The higher price tag is like a donation to open source. I would say the higher price tag is more like "Prusa" using its name as a quality assurance system where if you want to get something working without much hassle (since nearly every other mk4/mk3s clone that has been out there really really sucks except the ones from Prusa) you have to pay the premium. This is not to say they are necesarrily doing a bad job on open sourcing or abusing, but just a mark that "open source hardware" doesn't necessarily benefit the customer as much as "real world features".
  - freetime2 4y ago
    > since nearly every other mk4/mk3s clone that has been out there really really sucks except the ones from Prusa I have had an Ender-3 V2 for a few years and it definitely doesn’t suck. I did add a BL Touch sensor for auto-leveling, and OctoPrint for remote printing/monitoring - which are great convenience upgrades. But the printer itself is very reliable and the only maintenance I’ve needed to do is to replace a few clogged nozzles. For anyone just getting into 3D printing I would definitely recommend an inexpensive i3-style printer vs spending two to three times as much on a Prusa.
    - vanadium 4y ago
      Not to mention that to a large extent, you can spend the difference between stock unit prices making an Ender-3 v2 nearly as capable as a $799-$1,000 printer. Does it make sense? Overkill? Depends what you want to get out of the hobby. Can’t scoff at those who want to learn the fundamentals of 3D printing through the experience of modding and tuning ad nauseum because it’s _just not quite there yet_. I’m one of those Ender-3 V2 folks who can’t stop tweaking and modding and it’s been a frustratingly awesome and educational ride for the last year and some change. No regrets. I’ve gotten great prints along the way. But now, if I add a printer in the future that promises to “just work” and it doesn’t, I can diagnose/fix pretty quickly. Which I might just do.
  - eropple 4y ago
    > since nearly every other mk4/mk3s clone that has been out there really really sucks except the ones from Prusa The Sovol SV06 has been selling like gangbusters for the last six months or so, and it's excellent. And it's sub-$250. If you move a little further away from the i3 clones (and the SV06 absolutely is clone-y), that's where Elegoo--or Anycubic if you buy judiciously, or even Creality if you get it on sale--still make the argument quite difficult.
- kramerger 4y ago
  Thats an odd analogy. Prusa loves open source and maker mentality. Just look at PrusaSlicer and Printables.
- 2muchcoffeeman 4y ago
  I don’t know why this is being down voted. Prusa are trying to make an open source hardware company work and I guess this is what it looks like. There is so much noise on HN about repairability. Well here is some open hardware And it’s ”the Chinese printers have so much more features!”
  - eropple 4y ago
    Prusa absolutely builds good stuff, but their level of repairability just isn't different from most other printers--Bambu notably excepted, as they're a pretty closed system. They're all extremely commodity parts, from boards to v-wheels. I wish them well, but the value of their devices to date just does not equal the price. (The Prusa XL may change this and I'm really excited to play with one.
    - 2muchcoffeeman 4y ago
      Bambu just proves the point. Do you think they are going to make more integrated and closed systems or start opening up? Someone has to take the hit with development. And that costs money. >but the value of their devices to date just does not equal the price Has the value in terms of price to features ever really been competitive? I got the MK3 soon after it was released and even then you could get an i3 clone for much cheaper that produced similar results. The Chinese clones didn’t have 3D printed parts either. But now is the time Prusa is not price competitive?
      - eropple 4y ago
        In the last year, I've bought two separate sub-$250 3D printers that I just threw on a table after connecting four screws and a couple cables and they were dead-on out of the box. Prusa's hat has been "it just works!". That's been the conceptual moat. That is the part that isn't distinctive anymore.
        postalrat 4y ago
        Most cheap tools work at least once right out of the box.
rhinoceraptor 4y ago
This seems like a bit of a stop-gap since the Prusa XL seems to be taking longer to get going than expected, I would hope their plan is to totally rearchitect around the Prusa XL design and scale that down to the 250mm^3 size class. They are still very good machines, but I would have a hard time recommending anyone get an i3 style printer when the advantages of CoreXY are so obvious, and particularly because the price gap between the X1C is not very big.

f38zf5vdt 4y ago

It's a proprietary versus open source argument. You can build a mk4 clone for much less than the price of a Prusa-branded one, as everything is open source. The higher price tag is like a donation to open source. Prusa also makes the open source XL if you want an CoreXY model, or you could go with a Voron which is also open source.

treesciencebot 4y ago
> It's a proprietary versus open source argument. You can build a mk4 clone for much less than the price of a Prusa-branded one, as everything is open source. The higher price tag is like a donation to open source. I would say the higher price tag is more like "Prusa" using its name as a quality assurance system where if you want to get something working without much hassle (since nearly every other mk4/mk3s clone that has been out there really really sucks except the ones from Prusa) you have to pay the premium. This is not to say they are necesarrily doing a bad job on open sourcing or abusing, but just a mark that "open source hardware" doesn't necessarily benefit the customer as much as "real world features".
- freetime2 4y ago
  > since nearly every other mk4/mk3s clone that has been out there really really sucks except the ones from Prusa I have had an Ender-3 V2 for a few years and it definitely doesn’t suck. I did add a BL Touch sensor for auto-leveling, and OctoPrint for remote printing/monitoring - which are great convenience upgrades. But the printer itself is very reliable and the only maintenance I’ve needed to do is to replace a few clogged nozzles. For anyone just getting into 3D printing I would definitely recommend an inexpensive i3-style printer vs spending two to three times as much on a Prusa.
  - vanadium 4y ago
    Not to mention that to a large extent, you can spend the difference between stock unit prices making an Ender-3 v2 nearly as capable as a $799-$1,000 printer. Does it make sense? Overkill? Depends what you want to get out of the hobby. Can’t scoff at those who want to learn the fundamentals of 3D printing through the experience of modding and tuning ad nauseum because it’s _just not quite there yet_. I’m one of those Ender-3 V2 folks who can’t stop tweaking and modding and it’s been a frustratingly awesome and educational ride for the last year and some change. No regrets. I’ve gotten great prints along the way. But now, if I add a printer in the future that promises to “just work” and it doesn’t, I can diagnose/fix pretty quickly. Which I might just do.
- eropple 4y ago
  > since nearly every other mk4/mk3s clone that has been out there really really sucks except the ones from Prusa The Sovol SV06 has been selling like gangbusters for the last six months or so, and it's excellent. And it's sub-$250. If you move a little further away from the i3 clones (and the SV06 absolutely is clone-y), that's where Elegoo--or Anycubic if you buy judiciously, or even Creality if you get it on sale--still make the argument quite difficult.
kramerger 4y ago
Thats an odd analogy. Prusa loves open source and maker mentality. Just look at PrusaSlicer and Printables.
2muchcoffeeman 4y ago
I don’t know why this is being down voted. Prusa are trying to make an open source hardware company work and I guess this is what it looks like. There is so much noise on HN about repairability. Well here is some open hardware And it’s ”the Chinese printers have so much more features!”
- eropple 4y ago
  Prusa absolutely builds good stuff, but their level of repairability just isn't different from most other printers--Bambu notably excepted, as they're a pretty closed system. They're all extremely commodity parts, from boards to v-wheels. I wish them well, but the value of their devices to date just does not equal the price. (The Prusa XL may change this and I'm really excited to play with one.
  - 2muchcoffeeman 4y ago
    Bambu just proves the point. Do you think they are going to make more integrated and closed systems or start opening up? Someone has to take the hit with development. And that costs money. >but the value of their devices to date just does not equal the price Has the value in terms of price to features ever really been competitive? I got the MK3 soon after it was released and even then you could get an i3 clone for much cheaper that produced similar results. The Chinese clones didn’t have 3D printed parts either. But now is the time Prusa is not price competitive?
    - eropple 4y ago
      In the last year, I've bought two separate sub-$250 3D printers that I just threw on a table after connecting four screws and a couple cables and they were dead-on out of the box. Prusa's hat has been "it just works!". That's been the conceptual moat. That is the part that isn't distinctive anymore.
      - postalrat 4y ago
        Most cheap tools work at least once right out of the box.

rhinoceraptor 4y ago

This seems like a bit of a stop-gap since the Prusa XL seems to be taking longer to get going than expected, I would hope their plan is to totally rearchitect around the Prusa XL design and scale that down to the 250mm^3 size class. They are still very good machines, but I would have a hard time recommending anyone get an i3 style printer when the advantages of CoreXY are so obvious, and particularly because the price gap between the X1C is not very big.