5 ms·

Why would you buy a laptop that you cannot install updates on without jumping though hoops?

nordsieck 4y ago
> Why would you buy a laptop that you cannot install updates on without jumping though hoops? Maybe you're buying used and you can get a great deal that just has that one drawback.
- trelane 4y ago
  That's fair. Also, not everyone can pay the premiums due to having a much smaller market either, I suppose. Too bad many that can don't. There's no way for the little players to achieve economies of scale of the big players if folks keep buying Windows hardware from the big players.
sigzero 4y ago
No idea but people in fact do that.
elteto 4y ago
Simple, because for running Linux there are not that many options. And the X1 Carbon is very nice hardware. Also, with that mentality, we would never extend Linux support to new hardware.
- trelane 4y ago
  > And the X1 Carbon is very nice hardware. It doesn't sound as good as a fully supported option. It sounds a lot like commodity Windows hardware. > Also, with that mentality, we would never extend Linux support to new hardware. No, hobbyists will still do it (see e.g. Asahi) If folks keep giving their money to Windows hardware companies instead of Linux ones, they should not be surprised if the range if Linux-supporting hardware remains smaller. Like if you could just slap OSX on some random Windows PC M1 and such would never have come about. We actually have options as Linux users these days. It's a shame folks insist on wasting the opportunity.
- mijamo 4y ago
  The X1 carbon does have fwupdates on Linux, no need for Windows
ChuckNorris89 4y ago
Because you already have a laptop? Or they got a laptop from someone like family or an employer? And unless you're a GNU/Nerd, most people have better uses for their time than scouring through the web to find out if fwupd works for the HW when they go shopping for a new laptop. Most normal people just buy a laptop that fits them best and that's it. After all, why would they need to do any extra research for this? Isn't the whole internet and HN preaching that the year of the Linux is here and that it "just works(TM)"? Maybe not without caveats.
- trelane 4y ago
  > Maybe not watthout caveats. If you keep buying Windows hardware and slapping Linux on it, you'll have to be the systems integration team all by yourself. Without documentation of the hardware, or support. It's a mug's game. Don't play it. Buy Linux hardware, with support.
  - ChuckNorris89 4y ago
    If Linux only works on Linux only hardware, then Linux enthusiasts should stop preaching to the Average Joes that it's the year of the Linux and everyone can easily switch from Windows to Linux and everything "just works(TM)", if that isn't completely true, or just be openly honest about the caveats from the start, as most people switching to Linux aren't going to buy new machines just for Linux, but will most likely seek to reuses existing ones they have. And many people in many markets don't have easy access to buying linux specific laptops. A HP, Dell or Lenovo is much easier to find around the world, and most importantly, easier to get service for it when it breaks versus boutique Linux laptop makers like Slimbook, System76, Framework, etc.
    - trelane 4y ago
      I don't think most enthusiasts actually believe slapping Linux on any random piece of Windows hardware will Just Work 100%. Maybe 90%, but there are lots of edge cases. Modern hardware is extremely complicated, and there will be lots of random glitches unless you either do lots of homework and/or are extremely lucky. Or you buy Linux hardware with support. Perhaps you're thinking of responses to the perennial genre of, "I slapped Linux on my Windows box, and it was terrible, so Linux sucks!" posts?

> Why would you buy a laptop that you cannot install updates on without jumping though hoops? Maybe you're buying used and you can get a great deal that just has that one drawback.

trelane 4y ago
That's fair. Also, not everyone can pay the premiums due to having a much smaller market either, I suppose. Too bad many that can don't. There's no way for the little players to achieve economies of scale of the big players if folks keep buying Windows hardware from the big players.

sigzero 4y ago

No idea but people in fact do that.

elteto 4y ago

Simple, because for running Linux there are not that many options. And the X1 Carbon is very nice hardware. Also, with that mentality, we would never extend Linux support to new hardware.

trelane 4y ago
> And the X1 Carbon is very nice hardware. It doesn't sound as good as a fully supported option. It sounds a lot like commodity Windows hardware. > Also, with that mentality, we would never extend Linux support to new hardware. No, hobbyists will still do it (see e.g. Asahi) If folks keep giving their money to Windows hardware companies instead of Linux ones, they should not be surprised if the range if Linux-supporting hardware remains smaller. Like if you could just slap OSX on some random Windows PC M1 and such would never have come about. We actually have options as Linux users these days. It's a shame folks insist on wasting the opportunity.
mijamo 4y ago
The X1 carbon does have fwupdates on Linux, no need for Windows

ChuckNorris89 4y ago

Because you already have a laptop? Or they got a laptop from someone like family or an employer? And unless you're a GNU/Nerd, most people have better uses for their time than scouring through the web to find out if fwupd works for the HW when they go shopping for a new laptop. Most normal people just buy a laptop that fits them best and that's it. After all, why would they need to do any extra research for this? Isn't the whole internet and HN preaching that the year of the Linux is here and that it "just works(TM)"? Maybe not without caveats.

trelane 4y ago
> Maybe not watthout caveats. If you keep buying Windows hardware and slapping Linux on it, you'll have to be the systems integration team all by yourself. Without documentation of the hardware, or support. It's a mug's game. Don't play it. Buy Linux hardware, with support.
- ChuckNorris89 4y ago
  If Linux only works on Linux only hardware, then Linux enthusiasts should stop preaching to the Average Joes that it's the year of the Linux and everyone can easily switch from Windows to Linux and everything "just works(TM)", if that isn't completely true, or just be openly honest about the caveats from the start, as most people switching to Linux aren't going to buy new machines just for Linux, but will most likely seek to reuses existing ones they have. And many people in many markets don't have easy access to buying linux specific laptops. A HP, Dell or Lenovo is much easier to find around the world, and most importantly, easier to get service for it when it breaks versus boutique Linux laptop makers like Slimbook, System76, Framework, etc.
  - trelane 4y ago
    I don't think most enthusiasts actually believe slapping Linux on any random piece of Windows hardware will Just Work 100%. Maybe 90%, but there are lots of edge cases. Modern hardware is extremely complicated, and there will be lots of random glitches unless you either do lots of homework and/or are extremely lucky. Or you buy Linux hardware with support. Perhaps you're thinking of responses to the perennial genre of, "I slapped Linux on my Windows box, and it was terrible, so Linux sucks!" posts?