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I used to think it was just an econ problem that could be solved with UBI but lately I am not sure we are psychologically ready for UBI. Looking at the stats, y

I used to think it was just an econ problem that could be solved with UBI but lately I am not sure we are psychologically ready for UBI. Looking at the stats, young men who drop out of the labor force tend to spend their time on things like videogames, porn and marijuana rather than building a meaningful life.

kranke155 4y ago
People working in factories could be described as “not having a meaningful life”. Living a meaningful life is a choice left up to the individual. What are most people going to do when we automate everything ?
- twblalock 4y ago
  A lot of people in the rust belt want those factory jobs back, because they were proud to support themselves through work and derived personal fulfillment from it. And they vote, and we know who most of them voted for last time... If people could just change their minds about this, they would have done it by now.
twblalock 4y ago
Just look at all the ridiculous ways people spent their Covid aid money. That pretty much tells us all we need to know.
AlecSchueler 4y ago
That's within a context of living in a society that tells you you're worthless without work, though. That's something we can change.
- hammock 4y ago
  I’d like to hear more about this. What could be the meaningfulness of a life spent on videogames, porn and marijuana, if we were to change society’s perceptions about it?
  - kranke155 4y ago
    If you're having a good time and not harming anyone, what's the problem? Do you know for sure you know the conditions for the happiness of all humans ? Because if you don't, then having them sort it themselves might be the best solution. But of course by saying "Receiving value for work makes you happy" you're already saying that somehow our system works great at this. But isn't it our current system that's causing a massive mental health crisis already?
  - AlecSchueler 4y ago
    I meant more that as soon as you leave the workforce as a young man society will frame you as useless, which in turn leads to poor self image and depression, which then leads to a life of quick fix feel good activities like getting high and jerking off for days at a time. If we decouple workplace productivity and social validity then people who leave the workforce can find other meaningful ventures in their lives without shame.
    - hammock 4y ago
      Can you give some examples of what those ventures might be? How will these people be supported?

kranke155 4y ago

People working in factories could be described as “not having a meaningful life”. Living a meaningful life is a choice left up to the individual. What are most people going to do when we automate everything ?

twblalock 4y ago
A lot of people in the rust belt want those factory jobs back, because they were proud to support themselves through work and derived personal fulfillment from it. And they vote, and we know who most of them voted for last time... If people could just change their minds about this, they would have done it by now.

twblalock 4y ago

Just look at all the ridiculous ways people spent their Covid aid money. That pretty much tells us all we need to know.

AlecSchueler 4y ago

That's within a context of living in a society that tells you you're worthless without work, though. That's something we can change.

hammock 4y ago
I’d like to hear more about this. What could be the meaningfulness of a life spent on videogames, porn and marijuana, if we were to change society’s perceptions about it?
- kranke155 4y ago
  If you're having a good time and not harming anyone, what's the problem? Do you know for sure you know the conditions for the happiness of all humans ? Because if you don't, then having them sort it themselves might be the best solution. But of course by saying "Receiving value for work makes you happy" you're already saying that somehow our system works great at this. But isn't it our current system that's causing a massive mental health crisis already?
- AlecSchueler 4y ago
  I meant more that as soon as you leave the workforce as a young man society will frame you as useless, which in turn leads to poor self image and depression, which then leads to a life of quick fix feel good activities like getting high and jerking off for days at a time. If we decouple workplace productivity and social validity then people who leave the workforce can find other meaningful ventures in their lives without shame.
  - hammock 4y ago
    Can you give some examples of what those ventures might be? How will these people be supported?