7 ms·

Actual #1. TikTok is banned in China, but in their similar app (Douyin) their kids are limited to 40min a day and restricted from a lot of the digital opium dri

by kirse 4y ago

Actual #1. TikTok is banned in China, but in their similar app (Douyin) their kids are limited to 40min a day and restricted from a lot of the digital opium drip that US kids are receiving in infinite quantities. Sounds like it'd only be fair to follow suit if China itself is limiting the poisoning of their own citizens: https://www.cnn.com/videos/business/2023/03/24/douyin-tiktok-comparison-wang-pkg-pt-intl-vpx.cnn https://www.cnn.com/videos/business/2023/03/24/douyin-tiktok...

charlieflowers 4y ago
It is mind boggling, and at the same time not surprising at all, that China is enforcing a humane policy to protect its children when we are not willing to do the same.
- goldfeld 4y ago
  It is also surprising to realize that China and the chinese actually think as a nation and have a sense of collectivism, whereas the US is to each their gun and their million dollars in the bank. China has always had this sense of being one thing, historically, and even the atrocious regimes, emperors, and dictators are always representative of a populace wish to centralize and control things fluidly and efficiently. Who knows, maybe it will work out, even with the price it has that westerners won't ever consider, or ever let go of a philosophical individuality.
  - harvey9 4y ago
    That's a pretty superficial take on both countries.
  - ddoolin 4y ago
    ...because they killed or chased away any dissenters, now and historically. Look at Taiwan, or Hong Kong, the revolution, or Xinjiang. It isn't some innate characteristic of the Chinese, it is intentional.
    - goldfeld 4y ago
      True, I had not thought about the survivorship bias, literally genetic I guess.
- poulsbohemian 4y ago
  >It is mind boggling, and at the same time not surprising at all, that China is enforcing a humane policy to protect its children when we are not willing to do the same. By whose standards? The United States has never been an ideologically cohesive nation outside some basic principles of representative democracy - and even those have been challenged at moments in our history. The moment you get beyond the basics of a unified military, postal service, weights and measures, and currency, you quickly get into the social issues that have plagued our cohesion since the founding of the nation. Is Uncle Tom's Cabin a seminal work in understanding US history, or subversive and dangerous? We can't even decide that as a nation at the moment, so "how much social media is good for our kids?" would be a very, very ugly discussion to have at a national level. I don't have Tik Tok installed, my kids only get the "reruns" off YouTube, but frankly I find it a bit extremist that the US government wants to ban an app that looks to me like people doing funny dances in their living rooms.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - natdempk 4y ago
    We need to move past the "TikTok = people dancing" stage of discussion. TikTok has expanded to be the dominant short form video platform for every interest, niche, and micro niche you can imagine that exists, and even ones you can't imagine. Please anyone reading this comment replace "TikTok = people dancing" with "TikTok = feed + discovery for short form video tailored to your specific interests no matter how niche". Yes this includes programming, science, education, dancing, gaming, cooking, acrobatics, painting, arguing, politics, news, weather, etc. basically anything you can imagine that isn't against their content policies.
    - poulsbohemian 4y ago
      That's fair - but if that's the case, how is that actually different from YouTube, Instagram, or any number of other platforms? It appears in two ways: 1) TikTok is really good at what they do. 2) They are a Chinese-owned company. It certainly feels like if it weren't for #2, they would be praised for their innovation and held up as a great American success story. I'm not saying that there shouldn't be skepticism in the name of national security, but of all the things threatening to destroy the planet on any given day, this feels low on the list.
- electrondood 4y ago
  I mean... gestures at latest mass school shooting
- harvey9 4y ago
  USA and China have very different societies so the best you could expect in the former is an opt in facility for parents to limit time in an app. Much as I think these apps are the junk food of tech, I still prefer a less authoritarian state.
- Quinner 4y ago
  Humane by who's standards? Should the government be mandating how to raise children? Maybe the government would think compelling church attendance is a humane policy to protect children. Or we could let parents decide how to raise their kids. Never mind that the policy here is actually not about protecting children at all, since its banning an app entirely where the vast majority of users are adults.
- goatlover 4y ago
  [flagged]
iudqnolq 4y ago
Only if you think a) the Chinese goverment is right and b) TikTok is notably worse than American social media. I, for example, disagree with both. I think the Chinese government is wrong about a lot of things, including the right way to raise kids. And I think TikTok is no worse than Instagram.
- kirse 4y ago
  a) the Chinese goverment is right The Chinese government is right in the sense that drug cartels generally avoid getting too high on their own supply.
- stametseater 4y ago
  > "Only if you think the Chinese goverment is right" Germany dropped bombs on the UK. The UK responded by dropping bombs on Germany. By responding in kind, was the UK therefore asserting that Germany was 'right' to drop bombs on the UK?
  - iudqnolq 4y ago
    You're taking my statement out of context. I was refuting the claim that China's restrictive social media policy is a justification for a similar US policy. If the UK justified their actions solely on the basis that because the Germans did it it must be ok that'd be unreasonable. (This isn't the right forum to get into it, but the ethics of civilian saturation bombings are much more complicated and I'm not saying either was in the right, though of course in total Germany was far far worse).
    - stametseater 4y ago
      Tit for tat is how wars are fought, not by finding a moral high ground. Like it or not, we are in a economic and information war with China. Bury your head in the sand if you want to lose it.
est 4y ago
Actual #2. Bytedance's other App NeiHan Duanzi (com.ss.iphone.essay.Joke) was banned by CCP with little explaination

by kirse 4y ago

charlieflowers 4y ago

It is mind boggling, and at the same time not surprising at all, that China is enforcing a humane policy to protect its children when we are not willing to do the same.

goldfeld 4y ago
It is also surprising to realize that China and the chinese actually think as a nation and have a sense of collectivism, whereas the US is to each their gun and their million dollars in the bank. China has always had this sense of being one thing, historically, and even the atrocious regimes, emperors, and dictators are always representative of a populace wish to centralize and control things fluidly and efficiently. Who knows, maybe it will work out, even with the price it has that westerners won't ever consider, or ever let go of a philosophical individuality.
- harvey9 4y ago
  That's a pretty superficial take on both countries.
- ddoolin 4y ago
  ...because they killed or chased away any dissenters, now and historically. Look at Taiwan, or Hong Kong, the revolution, or Xinjiang. It isn't some innate characteristic of the Chinese, it is intentional.
  - goldfeld 4y ago
    True, I had not thought about the survivorship bias, literally genetic I guess.
poulsbohemian 4y ago
>It is mind boggling, and at the same time not surprising at all, that China is enforcing a humane policy to protect its children when we are not willing to do the same. By whose standards? The United States has never been an ideologically cohesive nation outside some basic principles of representative democracy - and even those have been challenged at moments in our history. The moment you get beyond the basics of a unified military, postal service, weights and measures, and currency, you quickly get into the social issues that have plagued our cohesion since the founding of the nation. Is Uncle Tom's Cabin a seminal work in understanding US history, or subversive and dangerous? We can't even decide that as a nation at the moment, so "how much social media is good for our kids?" would be a very, very ugly discussion to have at a national level. I don't have Tik Tok installed, my kids only get the "reruns" off YouTube, but frankly I find it a bit extremist that the US government wants to ban an app that looks to me like people doing funny dances in their living rooms.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- natdempk 4y ago
  We need to move past the "TikTok = people dancing" stage of discussion. TikTok has expanded to be the dominant short form video platform for every interest, niche, and micro niche you can imagine that exists, and even ones you can't imagine. Please anyone reading this comment replace "TikTok = people dancing" with "TikTok = feed + discovery for short form video tailored to your specific interests no matter how niche". Yes this includes programming, science, education, dancing, gaming, cooking, acrobatics, painting, arguing, politics, news, weather, etc. basically anything you can imagine that isn't against their content policies.
  - poulsbohemian 4y ago
    That's fair - but if that's the case, how is that actually different from YouTube, Instagram, or any number of other platforms? It appears in two ways: 1) TikTok is really good at what they do. 2) They are a Chinese-owned company. It certainly feels like if it weren't for #2, they would be praised for their innovation and held up as a great American success story. I'm not saying that there shouldn't be skepticism in the name of national security, but of all the things threatening to destroy the planet on any given day, this feels low on the list.
electrondood 4y ago
I mean... gestures at latest mass school shooting
harvey9 4y ago
USA and China have very different societies so the best you could expect in the former is an opt in facility for parents to limit time in an app. Much as I think these apps are the junk food of tech, I still prefer a less authoritarian state.
Quinner 4y ago
Humane by who's standards? Should the government be mandating how to raise children? Maybe the government would think compelling church attendance is a humane policy to protect children. Or we could let parents decide how to raise their kids. Never mind that the policy here is actually not about protecting children at all, since its banning an app entirely where the vast majority of users are adults.
goatlover 4y ago
[flagged]

iudqnolq 4y ago

Only if you think a) the Chinese goverment is right and b) TikTok is notably worse than American social media. I, for example, disagree with both. I think the Chinese government is wrong about a lot of things, including the right way to raise kids. And I think TikTok is no worse than Instagram.

kirse 4y ago
a) the Chinese goverment is right The Chinese government is right in the sense that drug cartels generally avoid getting too high on their own supply.
stametseater 4y ago
> "Only if you think the Chinese goverment is right" Germany dropped bombs on the UK. The UK responded by dropping bombs on Germany. By responding in kind, was the UK therefore asserting that Germany was 'right' to drop bombs on the UK?
- iudqnolq 4y ago
  You're taking my statement out of context. I was refuting the claim that China's restrictive social media policy is a justification for a similar US policy. If the UK justified their actions solely on the basis that because the Germans did it it must be ok that'd be unreasonable. (This isn't the right forum to get into it, but the ethics of civilian saturation bombings are much more complicated and I'm not saying either was in the right, though of course in total Germany was far far worse).
  - stametseater 4y ago
    Tit for tat is how wars are fought, not by finding a moral high ground. Like it or not, we are in a economic and information war with China. Bury your head in the sand if you want to lose it.

est 4y ago

Actual #2. Bytedance's other App NeiHan Duanzi (com.ss.iphone.essay.Joke) was banned by CCP with little explaination