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The US does not live in an isloated vaccum where it's not affected by geopolitics. Your life will be impacted, personally when China decides to invade Taiwan.

The US does not live in an isloated vaccum where it's not affected by geopolitics. Your life will be impacted, personally when China decides to invade Taiwan. I don't want to be spied on by either government, but this point you are trying to make that China has 0 influence or means to impart change in American life is incorrect.

JohnFen 4y ago
> this point you are trying to make that China has 0 influence or means to impart change in American life is incorrect. That is most definitely not the point I was trying to make. I'm talking about data collection, not propaganda.
- diabeticApe 4y ago
  Well if TikTok is obligated by law to cooperate with the military, its main value proposition to the PLA is probably going to be its repositories of data on the citizens of foreign nations (particularly the US and its allies) and you can be pretty sure the data collection efforts are not being used to recommend some tasty local dim sum restaurants. In other words its highly probable that the data collected is used to support its propoganda efforts abroad. Given the close knit nature of the public and private sector fusion in China it might be safe to assume they are one and the same thing. Maybe TikToks role is not limited to just propoganda purposes but thats just too easy and valuable of a use case for it not to be employed in that context. I know of a few people on opposite ends of the political spectrum that eat up content that makes caricatures out of the other side. Not that this problem is limited to TikTok but in thier case being obligated to serve as an extension of the communist government it seems to be a ripe opportunity for spreading division and uncertainty in the citizens of rival countries.
  - JohnFen 4y ago
    Of course. But I was talking specifically about China's ability and interest in harming me, personally, directly. I was not talking about China's ability to do societal harm.
Jochim 4y ago
The way to prevent China from invading Taiwan was to foster a friendly relationship. The US has squandered what good will it had with China to the point that they and even India have aligned more closely to Russia as a consequence of the Ukraine conflict. The inability of the west to effectively put an end to Russian aggression in Ukraine only makes an invasion of Taiwan more likely.
- mikrotikker 4y ago
  It's clear you know nothing or are being obtuse to spread an agenda. See: one China policy
  - Jochim 4y ago
    I don't think I've been obtuse whatsoever. The existence of the One China policy doesn't change the fact that since 2015, broader US policy has shifted from viewing China as a partner to a competitor[0]. That policy has been described as "a blueprint for a Cold War 2.0"[1] and that: > Any effort on the Biden team's part to improve relations (and China has indicated a strong desire to do so) would likely have the administration fending off charges of being soft on China. The results of this approach have been, among others: a trade war, a president repeating conspiracy theories that blame China for Coronavirus[2], and publicly accusing China of controlling the WHO[2]: > "I chose not to make a statement today," Mr Trump said on Monday about the event, while describing the body as "China-centric" and "a puppet of China". > He said the WHO had "gave us a lot of very bad advice, terrible advice" and were "wrong so much and always on the side of China". More recently we've heard American politicians, in a congressional hearing, repeatedly refer to China as their "enemy". Are we supposed to believe that doesn't indicate how far relations have cooled? Are we supposed to be shocked that China doesn't align with US interests on Russia when the US has been displaying open hostility? [0] https://theconversation.com/trump-took-a-sledgehammer-to-us-china-relations-this-wont-be-an-easy-fix-even-if-biden-wins-147098 https://theconversation.com/trump-took-a-sledgehammer-to-us-... [1] https://www.npr.org/2021/01/23/959683134/what-trumps-declassified-asia-strategy-may-mean-for-u-s-china-relations-under-bi https://www.npr.org/2021/01/23/959683134/what-trumps-declass... [2] https://abcnews.go.com/Health/trumps-chinese-virus-tweet-helped-lead-rise-racist/story?id=76530148 https://abcnews.go.com/Health/trumps-chinese-virus-tweet-hel...

JohnFen 4y ago

> this point you are trying to make that China has 0 influence or means to impart change in American life is incorrect. That is most definitely not the point I was trying to make. I'm talking about data collection, not propaganda.

diabeticApe 4y ago
Well if TikTok is obligated by law to cooperate with the military, its main value proposition to the PLA is probably going to be its repositories of data on the citizens of foreign nations (particularly the US and its allies) and you can be pretty sure the data collection efforts are not being used to recommend some tasty local dim sum restaurants. In other words its highly probable that the data collected is used to support its propoganda efforts abroad. Given the close knit nature of the public and private sector fusion in China it might be safe to assume they are one and the same thing. Maybe TikToks role is not limited to just propoganda purposes but thats just too easy and valuable of a use case for it not to be employed in that context. I know of a few people on opposite ends of the political spectrum that eat up content that makes caricatures out of the other side. Not that this problem is limited to TikTok but in thier case being obligated to serve as an extension of the communist government it seems to be a ripe opportunity for spreading division and uncertainty in the citizens of rival countries.
- JohnFen 4y ago
  Of course. But I was talking specifically about China's ability and interest in harming me, personally, directly. I was not talking about China's ability to do societal harm.

Jochim 4y ago

The way to prevent China from invading Taiwan was to foster a friendly relationship. The US has squandered what good will it had with China to the point that they and even India have aligned more closely to Russia as a consequence of the Ukraine conflict. The inability of the west to effectively put an end to Russian aggression in Ukraine only makes an invasion of Taiwan more likely.

mikrotikker 4y ago
It's clear you know nothing or are being obtuse to spread an agenda. See: one China policy
- Jochim 4y ago
  I don't think I've been obtuse whatsoever. The existence of the One China policy doesn't change the fact that since 2015, broader US policy has shifted from viewing China as a partner to a competitor[0]. That policy has been described as "a blueprint for a Cold War 2.0"[1] and that: > Any effort on the Biden team's part to improve relations (and China has indicated a strong desire to do so) would likely have the administration fending off charges of being soft on China. The results of this approach have been, among others: a trade war, a president repeating conspiracy theories that blame China for Coronavirus[2], and publicly accusing China of controlling the WHO[2]: > "I chose not to make a statement today," Mr Trump said on Monday about the event, while describing the body as "China-centric" and "a puppet of China". > He said the WHO had "gave us a lot of very bad advice, terrible advice" and were "wrong so much and always on the side of China". More recently we've heard American politicians, in a congressional hearing, repeatedly refer to China as their "enemy". Are we supposed to believe that doesn't indicate how far relations have cooled? Are we supposed to be shocked that China doesn't align with US interests on Russia when the US has been displaying open hostility? [0] https://theconversation.com/trump-took-a-sledgehammer-to-us-china-relations-this-wont-be-an-easy-fix-even-if-biden-wins-147098 https://theconversation.com/trump-took-a-sledgehammer-to-us-... [1] https://www.npr.org/2021/01/23/959683134/what-trumps-declassified-asia-strategy-may-mean-for-u-s-china-relations-under-bi https://www.npr.org/2021/01/23/959683134/what-trumps-declass... [2] https://abcnews.go.com/Health/trumps-chinese-virus-tweet-helped-lead-rise-racist/story?id=76530148 https://abcnews.go.com/Health/trumps-chinese-virus-tweet-hel...