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Genuinely curious: does having no speed limit cause more deaths on the road?

mantas 4y ago
I remember there was a test run Australia and no speed limit didn't increase casualties. Whenever I come over to Germany, driving on autobans feels like a pleasure compared to eastern european highways with a speed limit :/
- defrost 4y ago
  Four dead was the usual number of casualties? https://www.upi.com/Archives/1994/05/24/Four-die-in-Australian-road-rally/8473769752000/ https://www.upi.com/Archives/1994/05/24/Four-die-in-Australi...
  - mantas 4y ago
    Cannonball shitheads do shithead stuff regardless of speed limit.
    - defrost 4y ago
      These are people specifically coming to the Northern Territory to legally drive at high speeds on unlimited road sections ... therefore directly relevant to the assertion that unlimited speed sections don't see additional road deaths. A more thoughtful evaluation would need to consider the unique isolation of the NT roads, the nature of actual traffic (road trains, first time tourist drivers, etc) , the nature of the road (long slow deceptive curves, dips, washouts, etc), relatively low traffic (and then suddenly a cluster). As I recall the NT was unlimited for "ever" (well, since cars first arrived in NT) outside of towns (as a Territory and not a state), then limited, then conditionally unlimited (and now perhaps limited again). One consequence of having unlimited roads was an increase in people driving beyond their abilities on roads they were unfamilar with (eg: Japanese dentists with no long open road experience driving super cars). For interest: https://www.whichcar.com.au/news/northern-territory-now-has-300km-of-unrestricted-speed-limits https://www.whichcar.com.au/news/northern-territory-now-has-... https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-37283797 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-37283797
      - mantas 4y ago
        If that area is unlimited „outside of towns“, it’s rather different from unlimited-in-proper-highways. Unlimited on a regular road is stupid. Unlimited in an isolated highway with no crossings or same level intersections is nice. Driving culture is important too. Somehow I wasn’t tailgated on German highways and supercars were happily waiting for me to get out of the way. Meanwhile back at home with 130km/h limit it’s common to do +10 and get tailgated with flashing left turn signal by those who want to do +20. But maybe they’d wait too if they knew they could speed more in an empty section down the road?
        defrost 4y ago
        > Unlimited in an isolated highway with no crossings or same level intersections is nice. In reality, in Australia, in NT and Pilbarra it causes needless death. I grew up in these areas and I have no personal issue with others of similar background driving at whatever speed they feel comfortable - I've drafted a light aircraft at 70 m/s ( 252 km/hr ) at a 3m ground clearance along such highways for extended periods of time (geophysical survey | fun) .. but they are dangerous in ways that newcomers don't account for. These are mostly single lane either direction highways .. if you over take a loooong three trailer road train (common on nor'west and NT highways) you might be surprised by an oncoming car that was initially invisible in a road dip ahead .. and at very high speeds next to a very long truck there are very few options. I can add further examples of the many ways people screw up on country roads but see no real need to labour that point. Suffice to say I agree that unlimited on open roads is nice .. but it's not always safe when you factor in other drivers, mixed traffic types, and most importantly mixed experience levels, tired drivers on 12+ hour hauls, etc. I've worked St Johns volunteer ambulance in remote areas and I'm all for fewer deaths that could have been avoided by lower speeds and better driving practices (taking breaks, not drinking on road, taking bennies, using mobiles, etc).
        mantas 4y ago
        > These are mostly single lane either direction highways .. It does not sound lik a highway. Around here, highways are opposite lanes separated (and usually multiple, with very very few exceptions), banned slow traffic, no single-level intersections, usually fenced off wildlife.
wongarsu 4y ago
Yes, but Germany compensates with good traffic rules and good driver education (one of the harder to get driving licenses around the world, with 18 hours of mandatory theoretical classes, practical classes, and theoretical and practical tests that cost you around €2000 overall). Going by [1] Germany has the 15th lowest per-capita traffic-related death rate, less than one third that of the USA. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-r...

I remember there was a test run Australia and no speed limit didn't increase casualties. Whenever I come over to Germany, driving on autobans feels like a pleasure compared to eastern european highways with a speed limit :/

defrost 4y ago
Four dead was the usual number of casualties? https://www.upi.com/Archives/1994/05/24/Four-die-in-Australian-road-rally/8473769752000/ https://www.upi.com/Archives/1994/05/24/Four-die-in-Australi...
- mantas 4y ago
  Cannonball shitheads do shithead stuff regardless of speed limit.
  - defrost 4y ago
    These are people specifically coming to the Northern Territory to legally drive at high speeds on unlimited road sections ... therefore directly relevant to the assertion that unlimited speed sections don't see additional road deaths. A more thoughtful evaluation would need to consider the unique isolation of the NT roads, the nature of actual traffic (road trains, first time tourist drivers, etc) , the nature of the road (long slow deceptive curves, dips, washouts, etc), relatively low traffic (and then suddenly a cluster). As I recall the NT was unlimited for "ever" (well, since cars first arrived in NT) outside of towns (as a Territory and not a state), then limited, then conditionally unlimited (and now perhaps limited again). One consequence of having unlimited roads was an increase in people driving beyond their abilities on roads they were unfamilar with (eg: Japanese dentists with no long open road experience driving super cars). For interest: https://www.whichcar.com.au/news/northern-territory-now-has-300km-of-unrestricted-speed-limits https://www.whichcar.com.au/news/northern-territory-now-has-... https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-37283797 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-37283797
    - mantas 4y ago
      If that area is unlimited „outside of towns“, it’s rather different from unlimited-in-proper-highways. Unlimited on a regular road is stupid. Unlimited in an isolated highway with no crossings or same level intersections is nice. Driving culture is important too. Somehow I wasn’t tailgated on German highways and supercars were happily waiting for me to get out of the way. Meanwhile back at home with 130km/h limit it’s common to do +10 and get tailgated with flashing left turn signal by those who want to do +20. But maybe they’d wait too if they knew they could speed more in an empty section down the road?
      - defrost 4y ago
        > Unlimited in an isolated highway with no crossings or same level intersections is nice. In reality, in Australia, in NT and Pilbarra it causes needless death. I grew up in these areas and I have no personal issue with others of similar background driving at whatever speed they feel comfortable - I've drafted a light aircraft at 70 m/s ( 252 km/hr ) at a 3m ground clearance along such highways for extended periods of time (geophysical survey | fun) .. but they are dangerous in ways that newcomers don't account for. These are mostly single lane either direction highways .. if you over take a loooong three trailer road train (common on nor'west and NT highways) you might be surprised by an oncoming car that was initially invisible in a road dip ahead .. and at very high speeds next to a very long truck there are very few options. I can add further examples of the many ways people screw up on country roads but see no real need to labour that point. Suffice to say I agree that unlimited on open roads is nice .. but it's not always safe when you factor in other drivers, mixed traffic types, and most importantly mixed experience levels, tired drivers on 12+ hour hauls, etc. I've worked St Johns volunteer ambulance in remote areas and I'm all for fewer deaths that could have been avoided by lower speeds and better driving practices (taking breaks, not drinking on road, taking bennies, using mobiles, etc).
        mantas 4y ago
        > These are mostly single lane either direction highways .. It does not sound lik a highway. Around here, highways are opposite lanes separated (and usually multiple, with very very few exceptions), banned slow traffic, no single-level intersections, usually fenced off wildlife.

wongarsu 4y ago

Yes, but Germany compensates with good traffic rules and good driver education (one of the harder to get driving licenses around the world, with 18 hours of mandatory theoretical classes, practical classes, and theoretical and practical tests that cost you around €2000 overall). Going by [1] Germany has the 15th lowest per-capita traffic-related death rate, less than one third that of the USA. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-r...