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> In your experience, how often do criminals come in and tell the guy behind the counter that they need gas to commit a crime? Be specific. And do you think cr

> In your experience, how often do criminals come in and tell the guy behind the counter that they need gas to commit a crime? Be specific. And do you think criminals come in and tell crypto exchanges that they are about to commit a crime? AML regulations do not apply to gas stations as they're not "money transmitters", it is that simple. I'm a bit surprised so many on HN don't seem to be aware of that. And luckily they don't, because those laws are immoral, ineffective and costly: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34667051 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34667051

acdha 4y ago
I’m not sure where you got the impression that anyone thought AML applied to gas stations. What were talking about was that in general various criminal conspiracy laws require you to have knowledge and intent, which is actually why AML is a special regulation on banks: you can’t say that you value your clients’ privacy over a law specifically obligating you to ask and report. That avoids the need to prove intent by setting specific easily-verified requirements which force the issue. > And do you think criminals come in and tell crypto exchanges that they are about to commit a crime? Well, ignoring the fact that they are unlike a gas station in having financial regulations, consider that the disbelief and mockery in this thread might have something to do with a defense based on not knowing that your customers are using you to launder money works much better when you don’t give prosecutors written statements such as "Like come on. They are here for crime." or "we see the bad, but we close 2 eyes." showing that you did in fact have knowledge.
- olalonde 4y ago
  I think there's a larger issue at play here. The standard for "knowingly selling" for AML regulated businesses and a gas station are vastly different. That's why you never heard of a gas station getting charged for that, and there probably never has been. I believe the point was that AML regulations only apply to some categories of businesses and others not, which makes them ineffective. They can be a slight annoyance to criminals but they do not stop them. For money transmission, it is trivial to work around them. And for spending, at a gas station, there's no problem at all. It is is just all a very costly and ineffective security theater, not to mention the many moral issues that come with it (e.g. billions of law-abiding, unbanked people).

acdha 4y ago

I’m not sure where you got the impression that anyone thought AML applied to gas stations. What were talking about was that in general various criminal conspiracy laws require you to have knowledge and intent, which is actually why AML is a special regulation on banks: you can’t say that you value your clients’ privacy over a law specifically obligating you to ask and report. That avoids the need to prove intent by setting specific easily-verified requirements which force the issue. > And do you think criminals come in and tell crypto exchanges that they are about to commit a crime? Well, ignoring the fact that they are unlike a gas station in having financial regulations, consider that the disbelief and mockery in this thread might have something to do with a defense based on not knowing that your customers are using you to launder money works much better when you don’t give prosecutors written statements such as "Like come on. They are here for crime." or "we see the bad, but we close 2 eyes." showing that you did in fact have knowledge.

olalonde 4y ago
I think there's a larger issue at play here. The standard for "knowingly selling" for AML regulated businesses and a gas station are vastly different. That's why you never heard of a gas station getting charged for that, and there probably never has been. I believe the point was that AML regulations only apply to some categories of businesses and others not, which makes them ineffective. They can be a slight annoyance to criminals but they do not stop them. For money transmission, it is trivial to work around them. And for spending, at a gas station, there's no problem at all. It is is just all a very costly and ineffective security theater, not to mention the many moral issues that come with it (e.g. billions of law-abiding, unbanked people).