4 ms·

> feel free to correct any errors in my claims What you say about mTORC1 is not supported by the leading academic researcher organizations in the field of nut

> feel free to correct any errors in my claims What you say about mTORC1 is not supported by the leading academic researcher organizations in the field of nutrition. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27886704/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27886704/ "It is the position of the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics that appropriately planned vegetarian, including vegan, diets are healthful, nutritionally adequate, and may provide health benefits for the prevention and treatment of certain diseases. These diets are appropriate for all stages of the life cycle, including pregnancy, lactation, infancy, childhood, adolescence, older adulthood, and for athletes." If you think you have greater scientific expertize about this then I urge you to pursue a career in the related fields, publish your scientific evidence in the top journals and eventually change the recommendations. Until you accomplish that me and everyone else reading this should rely on the position cited above. > political panels who are sticking their finger up in the air ... That is not the situation here. The climate policy recommendations on eating are based on the best current scientific evidence. See https://eatforum.org/eat-lancet-commission/ https://eatforum.org/eat-lancet-commission/

GoblinSlayer 4y ago
How many people have great scientific expertize to appropriately plan their diets if half of them believe in geocentrism?
waihtis 4y ago
Your linked paper doesn't reference mTORC1 a single time. Moreover, the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics has faced numerous criticisms about it's close ties to corporate groups such as McDonald's, Coca-Cola, Mars, and others.* It is fully within their interest to state "vegans need reliable sources of vitamin B-12, such as fortified foods or supplements" (a direct quote from your linked paper) as it supports the business models of their corporate partners. *https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academy_of_Nutrition_and_Dietetics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academy_of_Nutrition_and_Diete...
- at_compile_time 4y ago
  Interests aside, it is very important that everyone has B12 in their diet. Most people get it from animal products, so vegans need to be sure they're getting it from somewhere. Without B12, all of the health benefits of lower BMI, higher dietary fiber, and lower saturated fat and dietary cholesterol will be offset by higher stroke risk.
- sprucevoid 4y ago
  > Your linked paper doesn't reference mTORC1 a single time. Precisely! If there was established scientific knowledge of a mTORC1 problem with eating vegan then the leading nutritional science organization's position paper would cover it. It didn't so everyone, including you, have strong reason to doubt your initial claim. If new research of such a problem gets published in top journals in the field the next position paper will reflect that. Until it does laymen like you and me have strong epistemic reason to side with the position paper. As for possible corporate interests distorting the position paper, do you have any specific evidence about such distortion with regard to mTORC1? Saying that it is merely possible that such a distortion could happen, without any specific evidence about such distortion, is not a useful argument in this discussion because distortions in the opposite direction are equally possible. The meat and dairy industry are among the corporate actors that the AND has received money from.
prepend 4y ago
Your quote doesn’t dispute that dairy is good for promoting growth in adolescents. It just says that vegan diets are appropriate. If one is concerned with optimization then you would want to consider diets that are superior, not just adequate. Not taking a side, I just get frustrated when people present material to refute that doesn’t actually refute. For example a paper saying “daily is not superior to non-dairy diets in adolescents” would be a good refutation.

GoblinSlayer 4y ago

How many people have great scientific expertize to appropriately plan their diets if half of them believe in geocentrism?

waihtis 4y ago

Your linked paper doesn't reference mTORC1 a single time. Moreover, the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics has faced numerous criticisms about it's close ties to corporate groups such as McDonald's, Coca-Cola, Mars, and others.* It is fully within their interest to state "vegans need reliable sources of vitamin B-12, such as fortified foods or supplements" (a direct quote from your linked paper) as it supports the business models of their corporate partners. *https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academy_of_Nutrition_and_Dietetics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academy_of_Nutrition_and_Diete...

at_compile_time 4y ago
Interests aside, it is very important that everyone has B12 in their diet. Most people get it from animal products, so vegans need to be sure they're getting it from somewhere. Without B12, all of the health benefits of lower BMI, higher dietary fiber, and lower saturated fat and dietary cholesterol will be offset by higher stroke risk.
sprucevoid 4y ago
> Your linked paper doesn't reference mTORC1 a single time. Precisely! If there was established scientific knowledge of a mTORC1 problem with eating vegan then the leading nutritional science organization's position paper would cover it. It didn't so everyone, including you, have strong reason to doubt your initial claim. If new research of such a problem gets published in top journals in the field the next position paper will reflect that. Until it does laymen like you and me have strong epistemic reason to side with the position paper. As for possible corporate interests distorting the position paper, do you have any specific evidence about such distortion with regard to mTORC1? Saying that it is merely possible that such a distortion could happen, without any specific evidence about such distortion, is not a useful argument in this discussion because distortions in the opposite direction are equally possible. The meat and dairy industry are among the corporate actors that the AND has received money from.

prepend 4y ago

Your quote doesn’t dispute that dairy is good for promoting growth in adolescents. It just says that vegan diets are appropriate. If one is concerned with optimization then you would want to consider diets that are superior, not just adequate. Not taking a side, I just get frustrated when people present material to refute that doesn’t actually refute. For example a paper saying “daily is not superior to non-dairy diets in adolescents” would be a good refutation.