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Sure there are terminal words at the bottom. Natural language sentences eventually come down to relating some raw physical objects to others. We live in a reali

Sure there are terminal words at the bottom. Natural language sentences eventually come down to relating some raw physical objects to others. We live in a reality where objects have inherent properties like size and texture and warmth and location. That's not a priori better or worse than the reality where objects have inherent properties like being a station or a service. >No pure language-based learner can give the correct response without some kind of sensory-based information No pure classical reality learner could ever come up with quantum mechanics. They must have a sensory organ to feel the eigen states.

tsimionescu 4y ago
> No pure classical reality learner could ever come up with quantum mechanics. They must have a sensory organ to feel the eigen states. That's obviously not true, as biological organisms who lack such organs have still arrived at learning quantum mechanics (granted, we spent a few billion years inventing language first, but still, those tiny little microbes evtually learned how quantum mechanics works). I should also mention that we don't yet know whether the eigenstates exist in any sense, or are just a cool modeling trick to predict probabilities, or are actually wrong and there is some better way to model particle physics that perhaps doesn't require them at all.
- IIAOPSW 4y ago
  >That's obviously not true Yes, that was my point
Hendrikto 4y ago
> Natural language sentences eventually come down to relating some raw physical objects to others. Counterexample: Green is the color of hope.
- tsimionescu 4y ago
  That still ultimately refers to physical objects like human minds and printed symbols. If you want a purely abstract statement, "the square root of four is two" does better.
  - IIAOPSW 4y ago
    Squares are physical. Historically exponents were only understood as measurements of the diagonal on a square, a neat trick for architects building something in our physical reality.

tsimionescu 4y ago

> No pure classical reality learner could ever come up with quantum mechanics. They must have a sensory organ to feel the eigen states. That's obviously not true, as biological organisms who lack such organs have still arrived at learning quantum mechanics (granted, we spent a few billion years inventing language first, but still, those tiny little microbes evtually learned how quantum mechanics works). I should also mention that we don't yet know whether the eigenstates exist in any sense, or are just a cool modeling trick to predict probabilities, or are actually wrong and there is some better way to model particle physics that perhaps doesn't require them at all.

IIAOPSW 4y ago
>That's obviously not true Yes, that was my point

Hendrikto 4y ago

> Natural language sentences eventually come down to relating some raw physical objects to others. Counterexample: Green is the color of hope.

tsimionescu 4y ago
That still ultimately refers to physical objects like human minds and printed symbols. If you want a purely abstract statement, "the square root of four is two" does better.
- IIAOPSW 4y ago
  Squares are physical. Historically exponents were only understood as measurements of the diagonal on a square, a neat trick for architects building something in our physical reality.