12 ms·

The sad state of U.S. life expectancy

40 points by Avshalom 4y ago

imwithstoopid 4y ago
obesity...the story tries to pin this on COVID but COVID was mostly a fast-forward for obese people (or old people, or in the worst case, both) there are still some people who think COVID impacted fit people equally...as if it were some random lightning strike the least obese state as of 2019 is more obese than the most obese state as of 1990 literally no one is making progress now the rest of the world is adopting the American lifestyle and catching up to us on obesity too we dramatically underestimate the amount of physical activity we need we dramatically misunderstand nutrition next up in the US is people moving from merely obese to morbidly obese - 200lbs+ will be normal...300lbs+ is next-level HN has this weird thing where they tell me "correlation does not equal causation" so we can't really say obesity is related to diet and exercise suuuure
- News-Dog 4y ago
  >HN has this weird thing where they tell me "correlation does not equal causation" Correlation does-not *Imply* Causation : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_cau...
- Avshalom 4y ago
  "American children are less likely to live to age 5 than children in other high-income countries," the authors write on the second page. It goes on: "Even Americans with healthy behaviors, for example, those who are not obese or do not smoke, appear to have higher disease rates than their peers in other countries."
  - quags 4y ago
    A quick search of leading causes of deaths for children under 5 is firearms and second motor vehicle accidents. I do wonder what would cause other wise healthy adults to have higher disease rates than other countries.
    - Someone 4y ago
      > I do wonder what would cause other wise healthy adults to have higher disease rates than other countries. Possibly a measurement difference. More frequent testing leads to both earlier detection and thus higher reported occurrence. Another factor might be that it gives more false positives and thus higher stress levels and from that, higher incidence of various disorders. But also, the article doesn’t exactly say “other wise healthy adults“, it says “Americans with healthy behaviors, for example, those who are not obese or do not smoke”. Those people might have a disease from bad habits they had earlier in live. They also may not have truly bad habits, but yet lead a more sedentary live than similar groups in other countries, etc.
    - atchoo 4y ago
      Poor environmental controls? I hear more about don't drink or even don't shower orders in Michigan and Mississippi etc. than I do in Europe. Also groundwater contaminations like PG&E hexavalent chromium or Palestine vinyl chloride. American culture is quite a thing. Does anywhere else talk about things like the EPA as a New World Order conspiracy or have a political party that is popular because it proudly brags about letting companies pollute more? Not to mention... the cars. So many cars. Such big cars. And no walking.
    - decremental 4y ago
      [flagged]
- danielschonfeld 4y ago
  One has to wonder what it’ll take in this country to move away from cities meant for automobiles and not humans.
  - midoridensha 4y ago
    Probably nuclear holocaust. Americans in my experience just don't understand why car-based cities are so awful, and even when they think they want a walkable city and lifestyle, they're completely unable to actually make the sacrifices necessary to live that way (for instance, not getting an SUV-full of groceries every few weeks and shopping more frequently, buying only what you can carry home).
    - throwawayacc5 4y ago
      A vehicle full of groceries every week is more efficient than going two or three times a week. More time efficient, and requires less resources/power. I live walking distance to a grocery store and still go once a week or less. I bring a pull wagon that I park in front of the store, fill it up, and walk it back home.
      - midoridensha 4y ago
        A vehicle full of groceries means you don't have fresh groceries for most of the time. More resources? If you're walking to the store, this shouldn't be an issue, and in fact is a negative. Avoiding walking is why Americans are so fat.
        throwawayacc5 4y ago
        >A vehicle full of groceries means you don't have fresh groceries for most of the time. Luckily we invented refrigerators so this is not an issue. Things can stay fresh and just as healthy for weeks. >More resources? If you're walking to the store, this shouldn't be an issue, and in fact is a negative. Avoiding walking is why Americans are so fat. As in, buying in bulk saves money and resources versus buying in small amounts. Indeed Americans are fat, but adding a few walks here and there isn't going to fix that. American diet is absolute garbage and the portions are insane.
- MomoXenosaga 4y ago
  When I read that 60% of people are overweight it inspired me to get fit and become part of the elite minority. Every McDonald's fuels my willpower.
fastaguy88 4y ago
It would be very interesting to look at life expectancy trends over time for income quantiles in the US and other developed countries. My understanding is that there is are large differences in life expectancy associated with income and wealth in the US. I wonder if those differences are as dramatic in countries with longer life expectancies.
CobaltFire 4y ago
Stress is an issue that I don’t think gets enough credit. Obesity, PFAS, all the other current top candidates are absolutely a part, but I think the stress of living under our economic/political system is causing a lot of this. Stress causes inflammation, inflammation causes all kinds of issues. You can think of stress as an inverted proxy for wealth on a population level as well.
- fasteo 4y ago
  More to this. Stress drives cortisol drives obesity. This is a well established pathway, at least for some people with increased glucocorticoid sensitivity.
- londons_explore 4y ago
  Stress as a concept was only invented ~100 years ago. I do wonder if perhaps it wasn't our environment that suddenly became stressful (all your family at risk of dying of the plague has to be more stressful than missing a deadline set by your boss). Perhaps vulnerability to stress is caused by some other, as yet unidentified factor that suddenly became big around 1900?
meltyness 4y ago
Shockingly, it's drug overdoses. Apparently copious unfulfilling underpaid labor may lead to escapism. Simultaneously we're exporting inflation to our southern neighbors who have a robust, lucrative industry which may lead to conditions favoring that fate.
- unmole 4y ago
  > Shockingly, it's drug overdoses. Yeah, no. Drug overdoses account for ~100k of the annual 3.4 million deaths. That's less than 3%.
  - dragonwriter 4y ago
    Its less than 3% of total deaths, but when they happen is important. They do, in fact, account for the falling life expectancy.
    - unmole 4y ago
      > They do, in fact, account for the falling life expectancy. Talk is cheap. Show me the maths.
      - triceratops 4y ago
        People 44 and under accounted for 62% of opioid overdose deaths in 2020. https://www.kff.org/other/state-indicator/opioid-overdose-deaths-by-age-group/?dataView=1&currentTimeframe=0&sortModel=%7B%22colId%22:%2235-44%22,%22sort%22:%22desc%22%7D https://www.kff.org/other/state-indicator/opioid-overdose-de...
        unmole 4y ago
        The original claim was that lowered life expectancy was due to drug overdoses. Drug overdoses account for only 3% of all deaths. How much does the fact that 62% of them were under 44 move the needle?
shadowofneptune 4y ago
The whole article is worth a read, but the throughline is that there is no coherent public health policy in the US. Most other countries with a similar level of development invest more in public health and have more equitable access to screening, vaccinations, etc. By the time people get hospitalized, most of the damage is already done.
throwaway__3 4y ago
In my case it was diet. I switched to a whole food diet (raw fruits, veggies, some carbs, no added sugars). All my health issues went away (high blood pressure, diabetes, IBS, gerd). I miss going out to eat but all they serve here in America is slop.
- NoZebra120vClip 4y ago
  I agree, and you know what else went away when I switched to a whole food diet? My sleep issues. All my life I've suffered from C-PTSD and had terrible sleep patterns. Yet, when I cooked for myself and ate wholesome, organic foods with lots of fruits and veg, I woke up like clockwork, with the sun, and I slept peacefully, all night every night. It was miraculous. Absolutely a miracle.

40 points by Avshalom 4y ago

obesity...the story tries to pin this on COVID but COVID was mostly a fast-forward for obese people (or old people, or in the worst case, both) there are still some people who think COVID impacted fit people equally...as if it were some random lightning strike the least obese state as of 2019 is more obese than the most obese state as of 1990 literally no one is making progress now the rest of the world is adopting the American lifestyle and catching up to us on obesity too we dramatically underestimate the amount of physical activity we need we dramatically misunderstand nutrition next up in the US is people moving from merely obese to morbidly obese - 200lbs+ will be normal...300lbs+ is next-level HN has this weird thing where they tell me "correlation does not equal causation" so we can't really say obesity is related to diet and exercise suuuure

News-Dog 4y ago
>HN has this weird thing where they tell me "correlation does not equal causation" Correlation does-not *Imply* Causation : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_cau...
Avshalom 4y ago
"American children are less likely to live to age 5 than children in other high-income countries," the authors write on the second page. It goes on: "Even Americans with healthy behaviors, for example, those who are not obese or do not smoke, appear to have higher disease rates than their peers in other countries."
- quags 4y ago
  A quick search of leading causes of deaths for children under 5 is firearms and second motor vehicle accidents. I do wonder what would cause other wise healthy adults to have higher disease rates than other countries.
  - Someone 4y ago
    > I do wonder what would cause other wise healthy adults to have higher disease rates than other countries. Possibly a measurement difference. More frequent testing leads to both earlier detection and thus higher reported occurrence. Another factor might be that it gives more false positives and thus higher stress levels and from that, higher incidence of various disorders. But also, the article doesn’t exactly say “other wise healthy adults“, it says “Americans with healthy behaviors, for example, those who are not obese or do not smoke”. Those people might have a disease from bad habits they had earlier in live. They also may not have truly bad habits, but yet lead a more sedentary live than similar groups in other countries, etc.
  - atchoo 4y ago
    Poor environmental controls? I hear more about don't drink or even don't shower orders in Michigan and Mississippi etc. than I do in Europe. Also groundwater contaminations like PG&E hexavalent chromium or Palestine vinyl chloride. American culture is quite a thing. Does anywhere else talk about things like the EPA as a New World Order conspiracy or have a political party that is popular because it proudly brags about letting companies pollute more? Not to mention... the cars. So many cars. Such big cars. And no walking.
  - decremental 4y ago
    [flagged]
danielschonfeld 4y ago
One has to wonder what it’ll take in this country to move away from cities meant for automobiles and not humans.
- midoridensha 4y ago
  Probably nuclear holocaust. Americans in my experience just don't understand why car-based cities are so awful, and even when they think they want a walkable city and lifestyle, they're completely unable to actually make the sacrifices necessary to live that way (for instance, not getting an SUV-full of groceries every few weeks and shopping more frequently, buying only what you can carry home).
  - throwawayacc5 4y ago
    A vehicle full of groceries every week is more efficient than going two or three times a week. More time efficient, and requires less resources/power. I live walking distance to a grocery store and still go once a week or less. I bring a pull wagon that I park in front of the store, fill it up, and walk it back home.
    - midoridensha 4y ago
      A vehicle full of groceries means you don't have fresh groceries for most of the time. More resources? If you're walking to the store, this shouldn't be an issue, and in fact is a negative. Avoiding walking is why Americans are so fat.
      - throwawayacc5 4y ago
        >A vehicle full of groceries means you don't have fresh groceries for most of the time. Luckily we invented refrigerators so this is not an issue. Things can stay fresh and just as healthy for weeks. >More resources? If you're walking to the store, this shouldn't be an issue, and in fact is a negative. Avoiding walking is why Americans are so fat. As in, buying in bulk saves money and resources versus buying in small amounts. Indeed Americans are fat, but adding a few walks here and there isn't going to fix that. American diet is absolute garbage and the portions are insane.
MomoXenosaga 4y ago
When I read that 60% of people are overweight it inspired me to get fit and become part of the elite minority. Every McDonald's fuels my willpower.

fastaguy88 4y ago

It would be very interesting to look at life expectancy trends over time for income quantiles in the US and other developed countries. My understanding is that there is are large differences in life expectancy associated with income and wealth in the US. I wonder if those differences are as dramatic in countries with longer life expectancies.

CobaltFire 4y ago

Stress is an issue that I don’t think gets enough credit. Obesity, PFAS, all the other current top candidates are absolutely a part, but I think the stress of living under our economic/political system is causing a lot of this. Stress causes inflammation, inflammation causes all kinds of issues. You can think of stress as an inverted proxy for wealth on a population level as well.

fasteo 4y ago
More to this. Stress drives cortisol drives obesity. This is a well established pathway, at least for some people with increased glucocorticoid sensitivity.
londons_explore 4y ago
Stress as a concept was only invented ~100 years ago. I do wonder if perhaps it wasn't our environment that suddenly became stressful (all your family at risk of dying of the plague has to be more stressful than missing a deadline set by your boss). Perhaps vulnerability to stress is caused by some other, as yet unidentified factor that suddenly became big around 1900?

meltyness 4y ago

Shockingly, it's drug overdoses. Apparently copious unfulfilling underpaid labor may lead to escapism. Simultaneously we're exporting inflation to our southern neighbors who have a robust, lucrative industry which may lead to conditions favoring that fate.

unmole 4y ago
> Shockingly, it's drug overdoses. Yeah, no. Drug overdoses account for ~100k of the annual 3.4 million deaths. That's less than 3%.
- dragonwriter 4y ago
  Its less than 3% of total deaths, but when they happen is important. They do, in fact, account for the falling life expectancy.
  - unmole 4y ago
    > They do, in fact, account for the falling life expectancy. Talk is cheap. Show me the maths.
    - triceratops 4y ago
      People 44 and under accounted for 62% of opioid overdose deaths in 2020. https://www.kff.org/other/state-indicator/opioid-overdose-deaths-by-age-group/?dataView=1&currentTimeframe=0&sortModel=%7B%22colId%22:%2235-44%22,%22sort%22:%22desc%22%7D https://www.kff.org/other/state-indicator/opioid-overdose-de...
      - unmole 4y ago
        The original claim was that lowered life expectancy was due to drug overdoses. Drug overdoses account for only 3% of all deaths. How much does the fact that 62% of them were under 44 move the needle?

shadowofneptune 4y ago

The whole article is worth a read, but the throughline is that there is no coherent public health policy in the US. Most other countries with a similar level of development invest more in public health and have more equitable access to screening, vaccinations, etc. By the time people get hospitalized, most of the damage is already done.

throwaway__3 4y ago

In my case it was diet. I switched to a whole food diet (raw fruits, veggies, some carbs, no added sugars). All my health issues went away (high blood pressure, diabetes, IBS, gerd). I miss going out to eat but all they serve here in America is slop.

NoZebra120vClip 4y ago
I agree, and you know what else went away when I switched to a whole food diet? My sleep issues. All my life I've suffered from C-PTSD and had terrible sleep patterns. Yet, when I cooked for myself and ate wholesome, organic foods with lots of fruits and veg, I woke up like clockwork, with the sun, and I slept peacefully, all night every night. It was miraculous. Absolutely a miracle.