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I think we should be critical of any information that is coming from states engaged in the war and their supporters. I imagine Ukraine is generating as much fal
by bilqis 4y ago
I think we should be critical of any information that is coming from states engaged in the war and their supporters. I imagine Ukraine is generating as much false information as Russia, prime example is information about losses in personnel and equipment, both sides report small numbers of their own losses and astronomical losses suffered by the enemy.
I think we will learn actual truths about this horrific war only after decades has passed and historians will be able to dig out all the Russian crimes, all civilian and militant’s death tolls.
I hope this war will stop as soon as possible, it creates nothing but piles of corpses and destroyed cities. I can’t imagine how Ukraine will build itself up after all this is over.
- colordrops 4y agoIt's a form of propaganda to shame anyone who doesn't believe things unconditionally. The comment you are replying to is an example, using shame and insults to herd you into their preferred narrative.
- M4v3R 4y ago> It's a form of propaganda to shame anyone who doesn't believe things unconditionally. Not necessarily. If someone doesn’t believe something that is universally believed and for what there exist undeniable evidence (for example the fact that the Earth is round) then shaming this kind of thinking is not propaganda, it’s just stating the fact.
- colordrops 4y agoNo, everything, absolutely everything must be ascertained with a critical eye, backed by evidence. Even the curvature of the earth, which thankfully is relatively easy to prove to yourself. Nevertheless, it does not have special status compared to any other piece of knowledge. You can excuse people for mistakenly believing in falsehoods like flat earth when the wool is being actively pulled over their eyes in a dozen other ways, from religion, political propaganda, corporate lies for profit, and predatory employment practices. Why are shame and insults fair game for flat earth but not Christianity or unquestioning patriotism or support for capitalism? Shame and insults only cause people to dig in their heels deeper. If your goal is to raise the veil of ignorance you are failing. Everyone is ignorant in many ways. And your point isn't even relevant. Scientific facts and politically charged events aren't even remotely the same when it comes to ascertaining truth value. Never in history has there been a war where only one side spews propaganda.
- flohofwoe 4y agoSorry, but an idiot needs to be called out for being an idiot, no matter if it is about science or politics.
- colordrops 4y agoThe irony of your statement is thick.
- luckylion 4y ago> Even the curvature of the earth, which thankfully is relatively easy to prove to yourself. Do you test it each time someone claims that it's flat? I doubt it. > Why are shame and insults fair game for flat earth but not Christianity Where have you been living the last 50 years? Christianity is absolutely fair game, at least in the West (or maybe the Western West? you'll have different reactions in Poland). Best to reach for Islam if you want a religion you're in theory allowed to make fun of but not in practice. But even there, it's not society that punishes it, it's a small number of extremists that the mainstream tolerates for political reasons. And you're not allowed to criticize capitalism? One of us really must've jumped dimensions recently. > Everyone is ignorant in many ways. But it's not really the same. There's a difference between "I have no clue how DNA works" and "gravity does not exist and we're just not falling into space because the government has people with invisibility cloaks holding us down".
- colordrops 4y agoFalse flags do not fit into the same category as gravity not existing. The former has mounds of precedence.
- jstanley 4y ago> If someone doesn’t believe something that is universally believed If someone doesn't believe something that is universally believed then it's not universally believed.
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- akimball 4y agoStating facts is a common technique employed in propaganda.
- adolph 4y ago> shaming this kind of thinking is not propaganda Yes, it is either psychological warfare or some for of bullying to puff your sense of self. If one were confident in the facts, then manipulation using shame wouldn’t be needed. Perhaps the person using shame as argumentation should reflect on whether they really hold a belief or if they enjoy professing facts in ignorance.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- thesmok 4y agoUkraine does not publish any official numbers of Ukrainian losses, only confirmed numbers of Russian losses.
- bilqis 4y agoI don’t think it’s correct to call them “confirmed”.