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Planned obsolescence is annoying when it comes to light bulbs. But for general purpose computers and TV sets, planned obsolescence should be illegal. When buyin

Planned obsolescence is annoying when it comes to light bulbs. But for general purpose computers and TV sets, planned obsolescence should be illegal. When buying a general purpose computer mac, pc or chromebook, the manufacturers should be imposed to make sure the computer can run an open source operating system too. Apple have not paid anything as far as I know to the community that are working on drivers to make Linux run on their M1 and M2 Apple Silicon Macs. Most of the software the powers the Chromebooks is open source.

Dalewyn 4y ago
Why should Apple have to pay for something they never asked for?
- javchz 4y ago
  I think paid it's the wrong word, but I agree that at least they should offer drivers for the hardware you own. Like if I get an AMD card, they provide drivers for Linux, and windows. At least they should for devices they don't plan on supporting anymore themselves. A little bit idealistic, but we should make Apple accountable of their "eco friendly" image, we already have enough e-waste, to keep dumping good hardware to the trash because it not longer has support from Apple, despite working perfectly fine and safe with other OS like Linux.
- nextos 4y ago
  I think the OP means Apple should pay because they will provide support after Apple declares EOL. And the OP argues support beyond EOL should be mandated by law. At very least, manufacturers should be asked to unlock things and provide documentation to let the community support devices. It's incredible the amount of devices that have perfectly fine hardware but are crippled due to the lack of software updates.
  - throwaway2056 4y ago
    I dont think majority of the lawmakers or population cares. Verizon/carrier locking. Apple app store.
- throwaway2056 4y ago
  There is something called society. BTW, just because you do not use street lamps (as you use a car) means others still need sidewalk/pavement + street lamps.
  - k_bx 4y ago
    Yes but I want to replace the lamps with the ones I make. Why doesn't the Government pay me if I do so?
    - ThePowerOfFuet 4y ago
      No, that's not the same thing. After selling your streetlamps to cities far and wide, you have decided that your lamps won't be supported anymore, and their critical control software won't even be updated for security issues. Instead of leaving them unsafe to use, you need to make it so the buyer can continue to use them safely, even though the light output may be reduced or they might not be as cutting-edge (eye-friendly wavelength, for example) as your new offerings. Everyone is free to update to the new lamps if they want to, but there should be no artificial reason to force them to do so.
- kybernetikos 4y ago
  The argument is that by creating unnecessary waste they are imposing an externality on everyone. Why should societies that control the rules of trade within them allow a company to force extra infrastructure on everyone for safely disposing of a much higher level of waste? I think the suggested laws to combat this would be that companies must allow users to take control of their own devices once official support is no longer available. Paying enthusiasts to create a distribution of Linux for the device would be a cheap way of ensuring your devices fit that kind of law. It's just a way of saying that devices must be reusable, even without further manufacturer support. I had an original ipad, and it was almost unusable within a year of me buying it because of forced software upgrades it couldn't take.
- nibbleshifter 4y ago
  Societal responsibility to reduce ewaste. Apple devices are notoriously painful to recycle properly.
gonzo41 4y ago
I know of a hp9000 still doing production work. It wasn't always this way.
- fm2606 4y ago
  Just for shear curiosity can you give more info on what and where it is still in production. I find stories about outdated / obsolete hardware still being used for productive work intriguing.
  - gonzo41 4y ago
    It's running a few very old lab instruments that people are working very hard to replace.
    - fm2606 4y ago
      Thanks. I believe there was an article in Nature, or something along those lines, that was about this very thing; old hardware and software being held together using chewing gum and baling wire by the researchers so they could continue their research.
toastal 4y ago
Include phones to this list of general compute devices. The 2–3 year support of Android phones is a joke, but increasing it to 5 years is just a kick of the can rather than a solution. When an OEM’s support ends, firmware should be required to be open sourced so the devices can live on for other purposes instead of being a paperweight or e-waste.

Dalewyn 4y ago

Why should Apple have to pay for something they never asked for?

javchz 4y ago
I think paid it's the wrong word, but I agree that at least they should offer drivers for the hardware you own. Like if I get an AMD card, they provide drivers for Linux, and windows. At least they should for devices they don't plan on supporting anymore themselves. A little bit idealistic, but we should make Apple accountable of their "eco friendly" image, we already have enough e-waste, to keep dumping good hardware to the trash because it not longer has support from Apple, despite working perfectly fine and safe with other OS like Linux.
nextos 4y ago
I think the OP means Apple should pay because they will provide support after Apple declares EOL. And the OP argues support beyond EOL should be mandated by law. At very least, manufacturers should be asked to unlock things and provide documentation to let the community support devices. It's incredible the amount of devices that have perfectly fine hardware but are crippled due to the lack of software updates.
- throwaway2056 4y ago
  I dont think majority of the lawmakers or population cares. Verizon/carrier locking. Apple app store.
throwaway2056 4y ago
There is something called society. BTW, just because you do not use street lamps (as you use a car) means others still need sidewalk/pavement + street lamps.
- k_bx 4y ago
  Yes but I want to replace the lamps with the ones I make. Why doesn't the Government pay me if I do so?
  - ThePowerOfFuet 4y ago
    No, that's not the same thing. After selling your streetlamps to cities far and wide, you have decided that your lamps won't be supported anymore, and their critical control software won't even be updated for security issues. Instead of leaving them unsafe to use, you need to make it so the buyer can continue to use them safely, even though the light output may be reduced or they might not be as cutting-edge (eye-friendly wavelength, for example) as your new offerings. Everyone is free to update to the new lamps if they want to, but there should be no artificial reason to force them to do so.
kybernetikos 4y ago
The argument is that by creating unnecessary waste they are imposing an externality on everyone. Why should societies that control the rules of trade within them allow a company to force extra infrastructure on everyone for safely disposing of a much higher level of waste? I think the suggested laws to combat this would be that companies must allow users to take control of their own devices once official support is no longer available. Paying enthusiasts to create a distribution of Linux for the device would be a cheap way of ensuring your devices fit that kind of law. It's just a way of saying that devices must be reusable, even without further manufacturer support. I had an original ipad, and it was almost unusable within a year of me buying it because of forced software upgrades it couldn't take.
nibbleshifter 4y ago
Societal responsibility to reduce ewaste. Apple devices are notoriously painful to recycle properly.

gonzo41 4y ago

I know of a hp9000 still doing production work. It wasn't always this way.

fm2606 4y ago
Just for shear curiosity can you give more info on what and where it is still in production. I find stories about outdated / obsolete hardware still being used for productive work intriguing.
- gonzo41 4y ago
  It's running a few very old lab instruments that people are working very hard to replace.
  - fm2606 4y ago
    Thanks. I believe there was an article in Nature, or something along those lines, that was about this very thing; old hardware and software being held together using chewing gum and baling wire by the researchers so they could continue their research.

toastal 4y ago

Include phones to this list of general compute devices. The 2–3 year support of Android phones is a joke, but increasing it to 5 years is just a kick of the can rather than a solution. When an OEM’s support ends, firmware should be required to be open sourced so the devices can live on for other purposes instead of being a paperweight or e-waste.