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I'm coming here from a slightly different angle, as a computer engineer, but here's how I see it. If you're going to work at a tiny little startup of 2-3 peopl
by jff 15y ago
I'm coming here from a slightly different angle, as a computer engineer, but here's how I see it.
If you're going to work at a tiny little startup of 2-3 people, maybe they can't pay you. Of course, maybe they shouldn't be hiring interns at that stage of the game. I worked as an intern for a startup that size, though, and they still paid me $15/hour.
If you're working somewhere larger, it only makes sense that they should pay you if you're doing work of value. Telling you it's all about the experience is like that oft-told story where clients want web designers to work for free, because it's "good exposure" and will "expand your portfolio".
As an intern, I've laid out, soldered, and debugged PCBs, designed and assembled test equipment setups, made fiber optic cables, tested cameras for surveillance drones, re-written UIs to use WPF, done significant kernel hacking, and published several papers, among other things. All of these tasks generated value for my employers, and it only makes sense that they should pay me for it.
That's just my 2 cents, though.
- philco 15y agoYep - I agree, you should get yours. Maybe there should be a more robust culture of giving interns equity at early stage startups. VC's hate cluttered cap tables...but it would be a fair way to compensate students for their work if the startup can't afford to pay them.
- scott_s 15y agoIf you can't afford to pay someone for work [edit: in the US, can't speak for other countries], it's illegal for them to work for you. It doesn't matter if they're a student and you call it an internship, even if they get credit for it.
- UnFleshedOne 15y agoWhat's the purpose of this law? (I would normally expect opposite -- that it is illegal for you to hire them if you can't afford it.)
- scott_s 15y agoPerhaps you misunderstood me, so let me state it another way: you must pay people who work for you, even if their title is "intern." To do otherwise circumvents the minimum wage laws.
- wisty 15y agoThere's often exceptions for interns. I don't know about the US though. It's a common dodge in Australia to put people on as "trainees". I think it can be illegal if they aren't really being trained, and there's lots of other rules (like it must be an educational course requirement).
- scott_s 15y agoThere is no exception in the US. The only way a company can have an unpaid intern in the US is if that intern does no productive work for the company - that is, they don't profit from the intern's labor. My understanding is that it's actually rare for tech companies to violate this law. But I have heard that it is common in the publishing industry. See: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2412255 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2412255
- wisty 15y agoThat is an exception - US interns just can't be "productive". FTA: "50 percent of graduating students had held internships". Face it, most of them will be doing unpaid clerical work. It will be "educational", in that they will gain valuable office skills, but it won't really be legal.
- scott_s 15y agoMy point was that doing what you described is illegal.