4 ms·

Both of my parents were police as well. That is why I believed them when they told me never to talk to cops. It is not a matter of good cops and bad cops. The

by ydlr 4y ago

Both of my parents were police as well. That is why I believed them when they told me never to talk to cops. It is not a matter of good cops and bad cops. The issues are systemic and often complicated.

tracker1 4y ago
My dad would generally have said the same... most of it is BS. And the incentivization in a LOT of places is just warped. You definitely need to be mindful of what you say/volunteer... you should definitely report crimes. When stopped by police, you should be respectful and offer the minimum required, ask clarifying questions, "am I required by law to answer that?" and only give what you have to. That doesn't mean you have to be an asshole, and that doesn't condone asshole cops either. The point is, that broad brush strokes definitely don't help. Personally, I'd like to see most govt minimized, including police and standing down the military. I'd like to see far more community engagement, and strongly support 2A and self defense, I don't like seeing that eroded for larger/stronger govt.
- undecisive 4y ago
  > ask clarifying questions, "am I required by law to answer that?" and only give what you have to. I was under the impression that the police in the US are not required to be truthful and it's perfectly legal for them to give false legal advice if it'll make their day go smoother?
  - tracker1 4y ago
    My understanding is that it's mixed... I think it's supposed to be along the lines of, "am I being compelled to answer against my will?" or some such, in which case it can be inadmissible as evidence (IANAL). That said, if it were anything more than something like a basic traffic stop, I wouldn't answer anything other than my name and providing ID without a lawyer. Pretty much every interaction with police (outside family/friends) has been a traffic stop, an accident, or otherwise reporting a crime.
    - d1sxeyes 4y ago
      As far as I understand it, the responsibility is on you to know the law and your rights. If you are required by law to answer a question, you must do so. If you are not required to, you do not have to. What the police tell you has nothing to do with it. There are very few occasions when you can be required by law to answer a question without a lawyer present (and without a judge compelling you to do so). These questions tend to be very limited, such as name and address, and may be even more limited in states without a stop and identify statute. You should research these questions before you need them. The police are not required to teach you the law (with a very specific exception of reading you your rights when you are arrested) and are allowed to lie to you. They may also be simply mistaken about the legality of compelling you to answer a question. This may or may not impact the admissibility of anything you say, but generally provided the police officer reasonably believes what they’re saying is true, they will have qualified immunity and you will not be able to (successfully) take action against a police officer for lying to you. In any case, you should take personal responsibility for learning what questions you must answer, and any questions other than that you should respond to with some formulation that makes it clear that a) you are aware of your legal right to refuse to answer the question, for example under the fifth amendment and b) you are exercising that right. You should answer all questions this way, even seemingly innocuous questions, as inferences may be drawn from your choice to stop answering questions. Courts have also established that if you are unaware of your fifth amendment rights, then they do not protect you. You should get legal advice at the earliest opportunity, but certainly before answering any question you are not required to answer. Police also receive training on how to make it seem as though you are required to answer the question without necessarily saying so. For example “how many people live in your house?” may be the question. You might respond with something like “I would prefer not to answer that question”. The police officer might then respond with something like “I need to know how many people live in your house so I can record it in the report/make sure my colleagues are aware that there are people at home/because I need that information to perform a proper investigation”. They may even threaten you with arrest for obstruction, but at this point they have likely crossed a threshold and anything you say past that point is probably inadmissible. Although I’m not a lawyer, the above is my understanding of the recommendations of pretty much every lawyer about everything. You should do your own research or engage your own lawyer rather than listening to some loon on the internet with a Wikipedia degree.
  - kevviiinn 4y ago
    That's correct, US cops lie to people all the time in order to get information
- whinenot 4y ago
  >You definitely need to be mindful of what you say/volunteer... Alec Baldwin, the actor, may have voluntarily talked his way into prison by saying too much after the recent accidental shooting on a film set.[0]. [0]https://www.mercurynews.com/2022/04/26/alec-baldwins-sad-strange-revelations-to-police-hurt-his-case-legal-experts-say/ https://www.mercurynews.com/2022/04/26/alec-baldwins-sad-str...

by ydlr 4y ago

tracker1 4y ago

My dad would generally have said the same... most of it is BS. And the incentivization in a LOT of places is just warped. You definitely need to be mindful of what you say/volunteer... you should definitely report crimes. When stopped by police, you should be respectful and offer the minimum required, ask clarifying questions, "am I required by law to answer that?" and only give what you have to. That doesn't mean you have to be an asshole, and that doesn't condone asshole cops either. The point is, that broad brush strokes definitely don't help. Personally, I'd like to see most govt minimized, including police and standing down the military. I'd like to see far more community engagement, and strongly support 2A and self defense, I don't like seeing that eroded for larger/stronger govt.

undecisive 4y ago
> ask clarifying questions, "am I required by law to answer that?" and only give what you have to. I was under the impression that the police in the US are not required to be truthful and it's perfectly legal for them to give false legal advice if it'll make their day go smoother?
- tracker1 4y ago
  My understanding is that it's mixed... I think it's supposed to be along the lines of, "am I being compelled to answer against my will?" or some such, in which case it can be inadmissible as evidence (IANAL). That said, if it were anything more than something like a basic traffic stop, I wouldn't answer anything other than my name and providing ID without a lawyer. Pretty much every interaction with police (outside family/friends) has been a traffic stop, an accident, or otherwise reporting a crime.
  - d1sxeyes 4y ago
    As far as I understand it, the responsibility is on you to know the law and your rights. If you are required by law to answer a question, you must do so. If you are not required to, you do not have to. What the police tell you has nothing to do with it. There are very few occasions when you can be required by law to answer a question without a lawyer present (and without a judge compelling you to do so). These questions tend to be very limited, such as name and address, and may be even more limited in states without a stop and identify statute. You should research these questions before you need them. The police are not required to teach you the law (with a very specific exception of reading you your rights when you are arrested) and are allowed to lie to you. They may also be simply mistaken about the legality of compelling you to answer a question. This may or may not impact the admissibility of anything you say, but generally provided the police officer reasonably believes what they’re saying is true, they will have qualified immunity and you will not be able to (successfully) take action against a police officer for lying to you. In any case, you should take personal responsibility for learning what questions you must answer, and any questions other than that you should respond to with some formulation that makes it clear that a) you are aware of your legal right to refuse to answer the question, for example under the fifth amendment and b) you are exercising that right. You should answer all questions this way, even seemingly innocuous questions, as inferences may be drawn from your choice to stop answering questions. Courts have also established that if you are unaware of your fifth amendment rights, then they do not protect you. You should get legal advice at the earliest opportunity, but certainly before answering any question you are not required to answer. Police also receive training on how to make it seem as though you are required to answer the question without necessarily saying so. For example “how many people live in your house?” may be the question. You might respond with something like “I would prefer not to answer that question”. The police officer might then respond with something like “I need to know how many people live in your house so I can record it in the report/make sure my colleagues are aware that there are people at home/because I need that information to perform a proper investigation”. They may even threaten you with arrest for obstruction, but at this point they have likely crossed a threshold and anything you say past that point is probably inadmissible. Although I’m not a lawyer, the above is my understanding of the recommendations of pretty much every lawyer about everything. You should do your own research or engage your own lawyer rather than listening to some loon on the internet with a Wikipedia degree.
- kevviiinn 4y ago
  That's correct, US cops lie to people all the time in order to get information
whinenot 4y ago
>You definitely need to be mindful of what you say/volunteer... Alec Baldwin, the actor, may have voluntarily talked his way into prison by saying too much after the recent accidental shooting on a film set.[0]. [0]https://www.mercurynews.com/2022/04/26/alec-baldwins-sad-strange-revelations-to-police-hurt-his-case-legal-experts-say/ https://www.mercurynews.com/2022/04/26/alec-baldwins-sad-str...