3 ms·

I'm unfamiliar with this meme that "woke" is a made-up term. It's absolutely not a made up term. It's a term in use since the 1930s by African Americans that la

I'm unfamiliar with this meme that "woke" is a made-up term. It's absolutely not a made up term. It's a term in use since the 1930s by African Americans that largely matches the Desantis counsel definition above: there are systemic injustices, and they should be recognized and addressed. Its _definition_ (or lack thereof) when used as a derogatory term by conservatives complaining about all manner of things is what's often criticized (and memed) by the left. Your follow up examples, I think, corroborate this point. It's basically word-salad with no clear definition. Is it political correctness? Identity politics? CRT? Defund the police? (all things conservatives also tend to be unable to define). Is it an incitement to revolution? To shake (destroy?) the foundation of society? This deliberate obtuseness is by design, and you see it in this rant: to paint people who'd like to make society slightly better as radical reactionaries wanting to level society. It's obviously ridiculous and would be funny if it weren't so frighteningly effective at scaring the shit out of otherwise intelligent people. (Edited to add: another major problem I've noticed when talking about these things is conservatives tend to treat random Twitter users as representing some monolithic "the left", rather than some random dipshits on Twitter, whereas progressives tend to treat elected conservative politicians in-power as "the right" when criticizing them (e.g., referencing Ron Desantis instead of "they" or "these people", talking about people on Twitter).

mpweiher 4y ago
> unfamiliar with this meme that "woke" is a made-up term. Weird. It's all over the place. For example: "Now, he was preparing his constituents for the existential battle posed by their newest imaginary adversary: wokeness." https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/dec/20/anti-woke-race-america-history https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/dec/20/anti-woke-ra... > Your follow up examples, I think, corroborate this point. Nope. It (it's a single quote) makes it clear that those on the woke far left are playing silly word games. > It's obviously ridiculous True, the word games are ridiculous and pretty transparent once you see how they work (usually a simple variant of the Motte-and-Bailey fallacy). Anyway, good chat.
- the_gastropod 4y ago
  > Now, he was preparing his constituents for the existential battle posed by their newest imaginary adversary: wokeness This in no way suggests "wokeness" is a made-up term. It's no different than the right's use of "Socialism" as a imaginary adversary. Socialism exists. But it's been applied as a boogeyman for the better part of a century by conservatives. Harry Truman made this very argument in the '50s. [1] In that same spirit, "Woke" is a term often hurled at any idea that criticizes the status-quo. That these are similar scare words is not an original idea [2] [1] https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/truman-socialism-scare-word/ https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/truman-socialism-scare-wor... [2] https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/03/wokeness-socialism-liberal-threat-public-discourse/673430/ https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/03/wokeness-s...
  - mpweiher 4y ago
    Hmm..what does the word "imaginary" suggest to you, then?
    - the_gastropod 4y ago
      That those who complain about it—much like those who complain about socialism or fluoride—tend to see it everywhere. It’s not that these things don’t exist. It’s that their perceived threat vectors are unrelated to reality.

mpweiher 4y ago

> unfamiliar with this meme that "woke" is a made-up term. Weird. It's all over the place. For example: "Now, he was preparing his constituents for the existential battle posed by their newest imaginary adversary: wokeness." https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/dec/20/anti-woke-race-america-history https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/dec/20/anti-woke-ra... > Your follow up examples, I think, corroborate this point. Nope. It (it's a single quote) makes it clear that those on the woke far left are playing silly word games. > It's obviously ridiculous True, the word games are ridiculous and pretty transparent once you see how they work (usually a simple variant of the Motte-and-Bailey fallacy). Anyway, good chat.

the_gastropod 4y ago
> Now, he was preparing his constituents for the existential battle posed by their newest imaginary adversary: wokeness This in no way suggests "wokeness" is a made-up term. It's no different than the right's use of "Socialism" as a imaginary adversary. Socialism exists. But it's been applied as a boogeyman for the better part of a century by conservatives. Harry Truman made this very argument in the '50s. [1] In that same spirit, "Woke" is a term often hurled at any idea that criticizes the status-quo. That these are similar scare words is not an original idea [2] [1] https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/truman-socialism-scare-word/ https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/truman-socialism-scare-wor... [2] https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/03/wokeness-socialism-liberal-threat-public-discourse/673430/ https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/03/wokeness-s...
- mpweiher 4y ago
  Hmm..what does the word "imaginary" suggest to you, then?
  - the_gastropod 4y ago
    That those who complain about it—much like those who complain about socialism or fluoride—tend to see it everywhere. It’s not that these things don’t exist. It’s that their perceived threat vectors are unrelated to reality.