7 ms·

Care to elaborate on that? I'm fairly entry-level when it comes to vim and I'd be interested to hear some good examples of what it can do over something like su

• alinajaf 15y ago
  The level of comfort using vim for a proficient user is very very high, so much so that it becomes difficult to switch out to other editors. I'm quite sure that textmate, sublime and emacs are perfectly good editors, but there's no way I could ever switch full time. If you're a touch-typist and you become proficient in vim, the friction between thinking about an edit and it materializing on the screen in front of you is reduced. I think 'whoops, need a comma there', my hands move around a little without thinking and the edits done. Contrast this with move hand to mouse, click where you want to edit, hit backspace, type in new character. IME this is not necessarily faster, just a lot more comfortable once you get used to it. A lot of comments will say 'you can have vi-mode in <other editor>' but I've yet to see an implementation that covers the entirety of normal mode _and_ supports custom remaps, and even then the mappings would need an interface to its plugins before it approaches a vim-like environment.
  • nyellin 15y ago
    OK, I'm the grandparent post and I'll say it. You can have a vi-mode in Emacs and it is called evil-mode. Vim plugins obviously don't work, but there is a world of Emacs libraries and you can now extend your editor in lisp. There are still some inconstancies that bother me (e.g. special buffers that don't respect vim shortcuts), but overall I'm happy.
  • gnaritas 15y ago
    Why would I constrast it with reaching for a mouse? I've never in my life thought whoops, need a comma there, and reach for the mouse; other editors can be used through the keyboard, this isn't unique to Vim.
    • agscala 15y ago
      The laziness level that can be achieved with vim's modal editing still surpasses that of most editors. When you're used to vim and you have to use something else, you even become disappointed when you have to reach for the arrow keys. hjkl is far too convenient. Heck, I hardly use backspace anymore even.
      • gnaritas 15y ago
        Certainly, but then you're spoiled by vim and everything else sucks, or you're trying to find vim-bindings for it. I'd much rather be accustomed to standard bindings that work in most programs and move between them without all the frustration of overly opinionated programs that think their bindings are the best.
        • agscala 15y ago
          Or you can can just appreciate that you get to use one of the best input models only while you're coding, and settle for regular inputs the rest of the time. It's not like you'll forget how to use the arrow keys after learning Vim. I don't know if I'd call Vim overly-opinionated. It's a legitimately incredible way to work with text.
    • Djehngo 15y ago
      Because vim has a lot of commands which are to do with navigation, with standard editing controls you would either press the left arrow a bunch of times while watching the prompt and stop when it's in the correct place. Then you would enter the comma and repeat the process going right. (I know you can use home/end or ctrl to jump over words, however often these aren't always applicable and often still need visual feedback) In vim it's significantly easier to jump to the desired point on the line with fewer key strokes and no need for a visual feedback loop. In short; it's not the fact you can use the keyboard to navigate, rather it's the fact that you can navigate efficiently with the keyboard without having to think about the position of the cursor.
      • 15y ago
  • Derbasti 15y ago
    I would describe myself as a pretty proficient and comfortable user of Vim and I have switched to Other Editors for short and long periods of time. Really, switching text editors is like switching languages: Every time you learn a new language, you also learn a new way to think and express yourself. Vim is absolutely awesome, however it is but one way of editing text. Other methods have their own merits and incorporating their styles in your workflow will make you more proficient in the long run even if you eventually come back to Vim.
• nyellin 15y ago
  I'm fairly proficient with both Vim and Emacs and I can feel it when I'm not using either editor. For example, I'm using a browser on Windows and I want to jump to a line's end. In Emacs (or on OS X which uses Emacs shortcuts), that's Ctrl-E and in Vim that's $. On Windows, I fumble with the arrow keys or start reaching for the mouse. When you really know a fundamental text editor, that sensation of helplessness gets worse and worse when you can't use the shortcuts that are burned into your fingers. If you don't know what I'm talking about, I suggest reading the StackOverflow answer "Your problem with Vim is that you don't grok vi." http://stackoverflow.com/a/1220118 http://stackoverflow.com/a/1220118
  • beza1e1 15y ago
    That just means that you don't know the hotkeys, does it? It does not suggest that Emacs or Vim is objectively better.
    • chalst 15y ago
      No, I think he meant not internalising the proper use of vi's composed count-movement-edit commands and ex commands.
    • deleted 15y ago
      [deleted]
    • gchpaco 15y ago
      The conventional end-of-line hotkey for Windows applications is the End key, which on a fairly traditional keyboard like the one I am typing this on requires that my right hand move several inches to the right and find that key on the island; I can't touch type this effectively and it compares poorly to C-e or even $ (itself not especially a convenient operation). Gnome and the Mac don't have this problem because both of them largely retain the simpler Emacs style keystrokes; Firefox does have this problem (at least here) and it pisses me off every time.
  • Shorel 15y ago
    I think Opera comes with a VIM compatible keyboard setup.