5 ms·

Even then I take issue with the terms. By all popular accounts I was extremely "introverted" when I was younger. Having made a concious decision to change cer

by lusr 15y ago

Even then I take issue with the terms. By all popular accounts I was extremely "introverted" when I was younger. Having made a concious decision to change certain aspects of my life, I am now far more balanced, and I have more than one story that makes "extroverts" blush. Not once have I read an article that discusses introversion and extroversion as flexible personality traits.

wisty 15y ago
> Not once have I read an article that discusses introversion and extroversion as flexible personality traits. Myers-Briggs assumes that people have "types", which is not very nuanced. Anything which references Big Five Personality Factors is IMO better (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Five_personality_traits http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Five_personality_traits). It also has better traits (or types) - it's quite useful to think of people having a certain level of Introversion, Conscientiousness, Openness to experience (aka inquisitiveness, previously known as "culture" but that's not PC), Neuroticism and Agreeableness. All those traits are interesting. The main advantage of Myers-Briggs seems to be that its traits are all value-neutral (while Openness to experience is basically good, and Neuroticism is basically bad), and the Keirsey Temperament Sorter claims it can sort you into career bins (like "Fieldmarshal" or "Healer"), and compare you to famous people whos behavior seems "consistent" with that personality type. Perhaps someone should write some book classifying historical figures into Big 5 categories.
arguesalot 15y ago
Interesting that you consciously chose to be more "outgoing". I believe that (ex-)introverts still have less need for others. Do you believe that your needs have changed too, e.g would you be OK if you went back to living like an introvert tomorrow as you did in the past or would you be overly depressed about it?
- bh42222 15y ago
  would you be OK if you went back to living like an introvert tomorrow Being alone and not having a lot of friends is NOT introversion! Seriously, this is like calling narcissistic personality disorder extroversion. Those things are not the same!
  - arguesalot 15y ago
    That's what i wish to know, is he faking extroversion or not.
- lusr 15y ago
  The major reason my first relationship (at 28) failed was because of the love/approval addiction I had. At its core that was because of a set of dysfunctional beliefs I had about myself, and had little to do with introversion or extroversion. This is essentially why I'm suspicious of these labels because my experience of these traits time and again comes down to my beliefs, not some inborn characteristic I can't change. Thus the answer to your question becomes: Why would I want to go back to a set of dysfunctional beliefs about myself?
bh42222 15y ago
By all popular accounts I was extremely "introverted" when I was younger. Having made a conscious decision to change certain aspects of my life, I am now far more balanced... I'm guessing your level of introversion has not changed one bit. But that your sociality has grown with conscious practice. Social skills are something you practice. Introversion is something you are born with. I'm an introvert and everyone tells me I have great people skills and that I am charming and wonderful to have at parties and other events. And I have lots of friend. So how the hell am I an introvert? Simply, after a lot of social interaction I feel mentally drained and need some alone time to recharge my mental batteries. That's introversion. Not having a lot friends or having anxiety about large social gatherings - that's social shyness and it actually runs rampant among extroverts as well as introverts. Personal anecdote time: Every introvert I know, including myself, has no real fear of public speaking. Most get bored by the sound of their own voice when speaking to large groups. Every extrovert I know has a huge fear of public speaking, some honestly fearing it more than death.
- ChrisMac 15y ago
  I could make a really strong case that I'm introverted deep down and I get nervous about public speaking. I think what this really speaks to is that we should talk about specific traits one at a time, instead of trying to lump a million things under terms like 'Introvert'
- arguesalot 15y ago
  It's always interesting to see how others experience their introversion, not least because by definition introverts do not exchange much. For me it's not about "time to recharge", i tend to think like an introvert even when being the center of attention and don't feel shy about it. As a geek, i need rules and regularities, so i 've ended up with a law that there has to be a fundamental balance between "time spent" (because time is the ultimate limited resource) vs "reward". Usually, time spent with "things" is more rewarding than time spent with people, except when the person is truly exceptional but those moments are rare. And it all depends on the definition of "reward". The ability to function well socially is something introverts don't work on, but they should, not in order to become extroverts but because most (of those i know) are quite more interesting to talk to than the average Joe.

by lusr 15y ago

wisty 15y ago

> Not once have I read an article that discusses introversion and extroversion as flexible personality traits. Myers-Briggs assumes that people have "types", which is not very nuanced. Anything which references Big Five Personality Factors is IMO better (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Five_personality_traits http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Five_personality_traits). It also has better traits (or types) - it's quite useful to think of people having a certain level of Introversion, Conscientiousness, Openness to experience (aka inquisitiveness, previously known as "culture" but that's not PC), Neuroticism and Agreeableness. All those traits are interesting. The main advantage of Myers-Briggs seems to be that its traits are all value-neutral (while Openness to experience is basically good, and Neuroticism is basically bad), and the Keirsey Temperament Sorter claims it can sort you into career bins (like "Fieldmarshal" or "Healer"), and compare you to famous people whos behavior seems "consistent" with that personality type. Perhaps someone should write some book classifying historical figures into Big 5 categories.

arguesalot 15y ago

Interesting that you consciously chose to be more "outgoing". I believe that (ex-)introverts still have less need for others. Do you believe that your needs have changed too, e.g would you be OK if you went back to living like an introvert tomorrow as you did in the past or would you be overly depressed about it?

bh42222 15y ago
would you be OK if you went back to living like an introvert tomorrow Being alone and not having a lot of friends is NOT introversion! Seriously, this is like calling narcissistic personality disorder extroversion. Those things are not the same!
- arguesalot 15y ago
  That's what i wish to know, is he faking extroversion or not.
lusr 15y ago
The major reason my first relationship (at 28) failed was because of the love/approval addiction I had. At its core that was because of a set of dysfunctional beliefs I had about myself, and had little to do with introversion or extroversion. This is essentially why I'm suspicious of these labels because my experience of these traits time and again comes down to my beliefs, not some inborn characteristic I can't change. Thus the answer to your question becomes: Why would I want to go back to a set of dysfunctional beliefs about myself?

bh42222 15y ago

By all popular accounts I was extremely "introverted" when I was younger. Having made a conscious decision to change certain aspects of my life, I am now far more balanced... I'm guessing your level of introversion has not changed one bit. But that your sociality has grown with conscious practice. Social skills are something you practice. Introversion is something you are born with. I'm an introvert and everyone tells me I have great people skills and that I am charming and wonderful to have at parties and other events. And I have lots of friend. So how the hell am I an introvert? Simply, after a lot of social interaction I feel mentally drained and need some alone time to recharge my mental batteries. That's introversion. Not having a lot friends or having anxiety about large social gatherings - that's social shyness and it actually runs rampant among extroverts as well as introverts. Personal anecdote time: Every introvert I know, including myself, has no real fear of public speaking. Most get bored by the sound of their own voice when speaking to large groups. Every extrovert I know has a huge fear of public speaking, some honestly fearing it more than death.

ChrisMac 15y ago
I could make a really strong case that I'm introverted deep down and I get nervous about public speaking. I think what this really speaks to is that we should talk about specific traits one at a time, instead of trying to lump a million things under terms like 'Introvert'
arguesalot 15y ago
It's always interesting to see how others experience their introversion, not least because by definition introverts do not exchange much. For me it's not about "time to recharge", i tend to think like an introvert even when being the center of attention and don't feel shy about it. As a geek, i need rules and regularities, so i 've ended up with a law that there has to be a fundamental balance between "time spent" (because time is the ultimate limited resource) vs "reward". Usually, time spent with "things" is more rewarding than time spent with people, except when the person is truly exceptional but those moments are rare. And it all depends on the definition of "reward". The ability to function well socially is something introverts don't work on, but they should, not in order to become extroverts but because most (of those i know) are quite more interesting to talk to than the average Joe.