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> The writing was on the wall a long, long time ago! [...] These companies had 15 years to do it. I pointed this out in 2013 only to be literally shouted down

> The writing was on the wall a long, long time ago! [...] These companies had 15 years to do it. I pointed this out in 2013 only to be literally shouted down by my manager. I did so again in 2017 under a different manager on the same team with the suggestion that we investigate using SPAs and RESTful frameworks only to be told that Razor Pages was the way forward which, while an improvement, didn't do any wonders for our ability to attract/build technical talent or create rich user experiences. As a sibling comment points out (in a sentiment that I've echoed on HN before): > ASP.NET Web Forms are a complete trainwreck and an abuse of HTTP and other basic web development standards (e.g. by using javascript: URLs and POSTing forms for every single interaction with the page). It is broken by design. You can probably see why developers that chose this framework in the first place aren't interested in upgrading... learning actual web standards and state management isn't something they wanted to do in the first place.

andix 4y ago
Classic management f**-up. Some products/companies just die, because of bad management that doesn’t react to change. Get a new job ;)
- alexjplant 4y ago
  > Get a new job ;) Done :-). > Some products/companies just die, because of bad management that doesn’t react to change Some don't have to because they get paid no matter what.
  - andix 4y ago
    Sure, but at some point the last sane developer either quits or retires, and then they are completely f*ed.
    - mcbits 4y ago
      15 years of management experience. Oversaw the reduction of personnel expenditures by 90%. They'll do fine.
WorldMaker 4y ago
> You can probably see why developers that chose this framework in the first place aren't interested in upgrading... learning actual web standards and state management isn't something they wanted to do in the first place. This is why I'm personally extremely skeptical of both Razor Pages and all of Blazor (Client, Server, Unified, whatever). All of that feels a lot like "Web Forms Again, this time with more C#" to me. Parts of Blazor especially may as well be ASP Classic `runat="server"` and look just like it to me. It kind of feels like a lot of ASP developers have already forgotten the hard problems of ASP Classic and ASP.NET Web Forms and have been doomed to recreate them cyclically.

andix 4y ago

Classic management f**-up. Some products/companies just die, because of bad management that doesn’t react to change. Get a new job ;)

alexjplant 4y ago
> Get a new job ;) Done :-). > Some products/companies just die, because of bad management that doesn’t react to change Some don't have to because they get paid no matter what.
- andix 4y ago
  Sure, but at some point the last sane developer either quits or retires, and then they are completely f*ed.
  - mcbits 4y ago
    15 years of management experience. Oversaw the reduction of personnel expenditures by 90%. They'll do fine.

WorldMaker 4y ago

> You can probably see why developers that chose this framework in the first place aren't interested in upgrading... learning actual web standards and state management isn't something they wanted to do in the first place. This is why I'm personally extremely skeptical of both Razor Pages and all of Blazor (Client, Server, Unified, whatever). All of that feels a lot like "Web Forms Again, this time with more C#" to me. Parts of Blazor especially may as well be ASP Classic `runat="server"` and look just like it to me. It kind of feels like a lot of ASP developers have already forgotten the hard problems of ASP Classic and ASP.NET Web Forms and have been doomed to recreate them cyclically.