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The only thing that matters in a layoff is "severance package" Everything else is useless. If your co-workers liked you and wanted to say goodbye, they will c

The only thing that matters in a layoff is "severance package" Everything else is useless. If your co-workers liked you and wanted to say goodbye, they will call and throw a party. If I'm fired, there is no reason for me to log on to my workstation. All relevant documents are given to you anyway. Your personal items will be shipped to you.

TremendousJudge 4y ago
I think many people would disagree with this assessment. It's akin to saying that the only thing that matters in a job is "compensation", and everything else is useless. While some people hold this view, many others like to be treated nicely in other ways: good working facilities, nice colleagues, fun perks, etc. Same thing about getting laid off: it's never nice to lose your job, but even if the severance is good it's not nice to have your employer suddenly behave like an asshole, and that they think that your work is so worthless that it isn't necessary for you to wrap anything up.
- kcmastrpc 4y ago
  It's not that the things you mentioned don't matter, it's that employee<>employer relationships are transactional. While I maintain a friendly relationship with all the people I work with, very few are actually friends. If they are, we'll still talk after the relationship with my employer ends. Unless you have a contract with your employer around the severing of that relationship, neither parties are beholden to each other and any expectation of such behavior is ultimately unproductive and quite unhealthy (mostly for you, $bigTech doesn't care).
  - akozak 4y ago
    Not everyone sees work in that way. Human psychology is complex and often times it's difficult to reduce workplace relationships down to simple economic relationships. You might argue that people should view all work relationships as transactional, but I'm not ready to agree with that (I think it is better to see coworkers as complete human beings), and in any case that just isn't how many people think as a matter of fact.
    - temende 4y ago
      The point is that if you view them as anything other than an economic relationship, you'll be emotionally spurned by layoffs like this article alludes to. Also, the economic relationship is between that of employee and employer, not as much about relationships between co-workers.
      - akozak 4y ago
        Yes it's true! People with non-economic viewpoints are vulnerable to being hurt or taken advantage of by management. It sucks.
  - musicale 4y ago
    You're not wrong. The economic perspective usually determines company actions more than anything in practice. $bigtech really doesn't care, and it probably is incapable of caring due to its economic and organizational structure and priorities. It's the most realistic and accurate model for work at $bigtech. But layoffs can still feel like being cast out of your tribe. You lose the daily casual social interactions that humans tend to want and need, and maintaining actual friendships becomes much harder. Not to mention losing your livelihood, social status, and health insurance. The way companies communicate to employees that they've been laid off (locked out of the building, passwords stop working, maybe an email if you're lucky, etc.) is explained well by economics and company priorities, but from the human perspective it does rub salt in the wound. For hiring and retention purposes, companies will often claim that they treat employees well. The truth is you might be treated OK until the day you aren't, and layoff day is absolutely one of those days.
    - midoridensha 4y ago
      >Not to mention losing your livelihood, social status, and health insurance. That last part is a uniquely American problem.
aseerdbnarng 4y ago
How is this the top comment
mwest217 4y ago
I have lots of coworkers for whom I don't have personal contact information. It's very common to just use work email or work phones.
- tpmx 4y ago
  Linkedin is a hellscape but it has its usefulness once in a blue moon.
  - twelve40 4y ago
    funny enough, it's probably the least hellscape of a social network by now. At worst it's just a bit spammy and dull, all others are dumpster fires by now
    - midoridensha 4y ago
      LinkedIn is great; I really don't see the problem with it. 1. It has your resume posted for recruiters to see. You get emails from recruiters scouting you for jobs you might never have found on your own. Many recruiters are useless 3rd-party recruiters, but some are useful 1st-party recruiters. 2. You can keep in contact with your old coworkers; people you aren't close enough to have as friends through some other venue. 3. It doesn't actively spread conspiracy theories and destroy society. You get some recruiter spam, and that's it. The site is nothing more than a tool to aid your professional life and career, and it doesn't try to be anything more than that. What's the problem, exactly?
  - tdeck 4y ago
    When I worked at Google a lot of people didn't have LinkedIn. I guess because they'd been there so long and expected to stay for life.
- jjav 4y ago
  This is where LinkedIn shines. I try to connect there with everyone I work with and have been doing so since 2004. Build a great network, keep in touch with people I appreciate as coworkers and hopefully future referrals.
munificent 4y ago
This is true for spherical employed human resource units in a vacuum. It is less true for living breathing members of Homo sapiens.
- mc32 4y ago
  For a small organization with single digit employees, it's possible to give the layoffs a human touch. For mass layoffs that does not scale. Then there is the aspect where we can't have nice things because someone somewhere took advantage of some discretion and now HR sees any discretion as a potential liability so they don't afford that discretion but for rare exceptions.
  - Incipient 4y ago
    Essentially every worker should have a manager of some description, in not-massive teams (generally). That manager can convey to the employee, in human terms, what's going on.
more_corn 4y ago
No. It’s dehumanizing to get laid off in the middle of the night. The thing that matters is treating you like a person and telling you to your face. How would you feel if your wife left you in the night without having the courage to tell you to your face? That’s how getting laid off by 2am e-mail feels. Google crowed for years about how employees are family. Middle of the night firings showed that was a lie.

TremendousJudge 4y ago

I think many people would disagree with this assessment. It's akin to saying that the only thing that matters in a job is "compensation", and everything else is useless. While some people hold this view, many others like to be treated nicely in other ways: good working facilities, nice colleagues, fun perks, etc. Same thing about getting laid off: it's never nice to lose your job, but even if the severance is good it's not nice to have your employer suddenly behave like an asshole, and that they think that your work is so worthless that it isn't necessary for you to wrap anything up.

kcmastrpc 4y ago
It's not that the things you mentioned don't matter, it's that employee<>employer relationships are transactional. While I maintain a friendly relationship with all the people I work with, very few are actually friends. If they are, we'll still talk after the relationship with my employer ends. Unless you have a contract with your employer around the severing of that relationship, neither parties are beholden to each other and any expectation of such behavior is ultimately unproductive and quite unhealthy (mostly for you, $bigTech doesn't care).
- akozak 4y ago
  Not everyone sees work in that way. Human psychology is complex and often times it's difficult to reduce workplace relationships down to simple economic relationships. You might argue that people should view all work relationships as transactional, but I'm not ready to agree with that (I think it is better to see coworkers as complete human beings), and in any case that just isn't how many people think as a matter of fact.
  - temende 4y ago
    The point is that if you view them as anything other than an economic relationship, you'll be emotionally spurned by layoffs like this article alludes to. Also, the economic relationship is between that of employee and employer, not as much about relationships between co-workers.
    - akozak 4y ago
      Yes it's true! People with non-economic viewpoints are vulnerable to being hurt or taken advantage of by management. It sucks.
- musicale 4y ago
  You're not wrong. The economic perspective usually determines company actions more than anything in practice. $bigtech really doesn't care, and it probably is incapable of caring due to its economic and organizational structure and priorities. It's the most realistic and accurate model for work at $bigtech. But layoffs can still feel like being cast out of your tribe. You lose the daily casual social interactions that humans tend to want and need, and maintaining actual friendships becomes much harder. Not to mention losing your livelihood, social status, and health insurance. The way companies communicate to employees that they've been laid off (locked out of the building, passwords stop working, maybe an email if you're lucky, etc.) is explained well by economics and company priorities, but from the human perspective it does rub salt in the wound. For hiring and retention purposes, companies will often claim that they treat employees well. The truth is you might be treated OK until the day you aren't, and layoff day is absolutely one of those days.
  - midoridensha 4y ago
    >Not to mention losing your livelihood, social status, and health insurance. That last part is a uniquely American problem.

aseerdbnarng 4y ago

How is this the top comment

mwest217 4y ago

I have lots of coworkers for whom I don't have personal contact information. It's very common to just use work email or work phones.

tpmx 4y ago
Linkedin is a hellscape but it has its usefulness once in a blue moon.
- twelve40 4y ago
  funny enough, it's probably the least hellscape of a social network by now. At worst it's just a bit spammy and dull, all others are dumpster fires by now
  - midoridensha 4y ago
    LinkedIn is great; I really don't see the problem with it. 1. It has your resume posted for recruiters to see. You get emails from recruiters scouting you for jobs you might never have found on your own. Many recruiters are useless 3rd-party recruiters, but some are useful 1st-party recruiters. 2. You can keep in contact with your old coworkers; people you aren't close enough to have as friends through some other venue. 3. It doesn't actively spread conspiracy theories and destroy society. You get some recruiter spam, and that's it. The site is nothing more than a tool to aid your professional life and career, and it doesn't try to be anything more than that. What's the problem, exactly?
- tdeck 4y ago
  When I worked at Google a lot of people didn't have LinkedIn. I guess because they'd been there so long and expected to stay for life.
jjav 4y ago
This is where LinkedIn shines. I try to connect there with everyone I work with and have been doing so since 2004. Build a great network, keep in touch with people I appreciate as coworkers and hopefully future referrals.

munificent 4y ago

This is true for spherical employed human resource units in a vacuum. It is less true for living breathing members of Homo sapiens.

mc32 4y ago
For a small organization with single digit employees, it's possible to give the layoffs a human touch. For mass layoffs that does not scale. Then there is the aspect where we can't have nice things because someone somewhere took advantage of some discretion and now HR sees any discretion as a potential liability so they don't afford that discretion but for rare exceptions.
- Incipient 4y ago
  Essentially every worker should have a manager of some description, in not-massive teams (generally). That manager can convey to the employee, in human terms, what's going on.

more_corn 4y ago

No. It’s dehumanizing to get laid off in the middle of the night. The thing that matters is treating you like a person and telling you to your face. How would you feel if your wife left you in the night without having the courage to tell you to your face? That’s how getting laid off by 2am e-mail feels. Google crowed for years about how employees are family. Middle of the night firings showed that was a lie.