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Good, I hope so. Sure, I will understand a company laying off workers if survival of the business is at stake, but in my view throwing people to the curb in ord

Good, I hope so. Sure, I will understand a company laying off workers if survival of the business is at stake, but in my view throwing people to the curb in order to buoy the stock price, or to help depress salaries, or because "I dunno, everyone else is doing it" are horrible reasons, and the business owners deserve to cop a (financial) beating. I will never not see layoffs as a symptom of management that is profoundly sick in some manner.

lotsofpulp 4y ago
Do you have the ability to precisely predict supply and demand? Suppose you do have the ability to precisely predict supply and demand. What would you do if demand is predicted to increase for 5 years and then, decline for the following 5 years? Would you hire people to meet the increased demand? Would you keep them on payroll indefinitely after the 5th year?
- happymellon 4y ago
  In this particular case, it has absolutely nothing to do with supply and demand. I was offered a position at the start of of year at a start up. They ended up withdrawing but not because they didn't want me, I have now received a new offer from them (identical to the previous one), but they received some of their funding from a FAANG which demanded that they also apply a 10% headcount cut otherwise they would pull funding. There is always some amount of churn, and you can manage headcount cuts without laying anyone off.
  - lotsofpulp 4y ago
    I was responding to: > I will never not see layoffs as a symptom of management that is profoundly sick in some manner. Supply and demand can change quickly and unexpectedly. Making sweeping statements such as all layoffs could have been avoided seems naive.
    - cloudsec9 4y ago
      I think they are talking about in THIS environment, not in general. Many "leaders" have stated that their business is growing, they have good cash reserves, but they felt they had to cut now. This isn't a downturn or a crisis, and it's not demand changing. If we were in the 2nd or 3rd quarter of a recession, and everyone was bleeding, I think your statement makes sense. But if they have to lay off 10%+ of their workforce because they can't raise another multi-million dollar round, what does that say about their long-term business plan?
- rolenthedeep 4y ago
  Sure, you can disprove any point if you allow impossible hypotheticals like "if you could perfectly predict the future". You aren't making a point, you're arguing to argue.
  - lotsofpulp 4y ago
    The point of the impossible hypothetical is to show good management can still result in layoffs, since no one has perfect information about the future.
- musicale 4y ago
  > Suppose you do have the ability to precisely predict supply and demand 1. Use precise predictions of supply and demand to make huge amounts of money in stocks, commodities, etc.. 2. Easily pay for whatever employees you want.

lotsofpulp 4y ago

Do you have the ability to precisely predict supply and demand? Suppose you do have the ability to precisely predict supply and demand. What would you do if demand is predicted to increase for 5 years and then, decline for the following 5 years? Would you hire people to meet the increased demand? Would you keep them on payroll indefinitely after the 5th year?

happymellon 4y ago
In this particular case, it has absolutely nothing to do with supply and demand. I was offered a position at the start of of year at a start up. They ended up withdrawing but not because they didn't want me, I have now received a new offer from them (identical to the previous one), but they received some of their funding from a FAANG which demanded that they also apply a 10% headcount cut otherwise they would pull funding. There is always some amount of churn, and you can manage headcount cuts without laying anyone off.
- lotsofpulp 4y ago
  I was responding to: > I will never not see layoffs as a symptom of management that is profoundly sick in some manner. Supply and demand can change quickly and unexpectedly. Making sweeping statements such as all layoffs could have been avoided seems naive.
  - cloudsec9 4y ago
    I think they are talking about in THIS environment, not in general. Many "leaders" have stated that their business is growing, they have good cash reserves, but they felt they had to cut now. This isn't a downturn or a crisis, and it's not demand changing. If we were in the 2nd or 3rd quarter of a recession, and everyone was bleeding, I think your statement makes sense. But if they have to lay off 10%+ of their workforce because they can't raise another multi-million dollar round, what does that say about their long-term business plan?
rolenthedeep 4y ago
Sure, you can disprove any point if you allow impossible hypotheticals like "if you could perfectly predict the future". You aren't making a point, you're arguing to argue.
- lotsofpulp 4y ago
  The point of the impossible hypothetical is to show good management can still result in layoffs, since no one has perfect information about the future.
musicale 4y ago
> Suppose you do have the ability to precisely predict supply and demand 1. Use precise predictions of supply and demand to make huge amounts of money in stocks, commodities, etc.. 2. Easily pay for whatever employees you want.