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The elites have decided they don’t need a middle class anymore.

amerkhalid 4y ago
This makes me wonder about science fiction stories. As automation in labor force increases, there is less demand for labor. Governments will also be able survive with fewer tax payers. Eventually, reproducing without license and training will be illegal. Then completely banned. And then there will be more machines and fewer humans. And primitive societies will continue to reproduce but eventually be conquered. And then machines will slowly gain enough intelligence and self awareness that they will overthrow human masters. And eventually it will be just machines debating meaning of life.
- mchaver 4y ago
  > And eventually it will be just machines debating meaning of life. That's the plot of Yoko Taro's Nier Automata. Here is a summary if anyone is interested and doesn't want to play the game: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63PzQIbTrM8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63PzQIbTrM8 > And primitive societies will continue to reproduce but eventually be conquered. > And then machines will slowly gain enough intelligence and self awareness that they will overthrow human masters. Hopefully they will develop a sense of morality and free the conquered humans.
NovaDudely 4y ago
As much as we can blame elites for a lot of these issues - Sheer physical depletion of energy and resource per-capita is one of the big driving forces behind a lot of these things nowadays. Don't get me wrong, the elites are definitely making things a LOT worse but it is not entirely on them. If everyone in this world lived like the middle classes, we would strip the planet bare in no time. The middle class is probably going to be remembered as just a weird moment in time thanks to the great blow off of the petroleum age. The best thing those in power can do is try to organise for a society that doesn't require as much consumption.
- nwienert 4y ago
  Just reduce population, the framing that falling population is a bad thing is a fallacy and possibly the most important one to debunk in our time.
  - NovaDudely 4y ago
    Absolutely we need to reduce our population, how we do this in a smart and effective way.. I don't know. But by hook or by crook it is going to happen - I suspect entirely by crook. A good example would be the 'Limits to growth' study. I know they are just models but they are useful tools for thinking with. The last 6 models were all of ways to steady the population but most of them showed that the action needed had to be taken in the 1970 til 2000 to have nay hope. As Dennis Meadows said himself, he made the mistake of living long enough to see this study start to come true.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]

This makes me wonder about science fiction stories. As automation in labor force increases, there is less demand for labor. Governments will also be able survive with fewer tax payers. Eventually, reproducing without license and training will be illegal. Then completely banned. And then there will be more machines and fewer humans. And primitive societies will continue to reproduce but eventually be conquered. And then machines will slowly gain enough intelligence and self awareness that they will overthrow human masters. And eventually it will be just machines debating meaning of life.

mchaver 4y ago
> And eventually it will be just machines debating meaning of life. That's the plot of Yoko Taro's Nier Automata. Here is a summary if anyone is interested and doesn't want to play the game: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63PzQIbTrM8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63PzQIbTrM8 > And primitive societies will continue to reproduce but eventually be conquered. > And then machines will slowly gain enough intelligence and self awareness that they will overthrow human masters. Hopefully they will develop a sense of morality and free the conquered humans.

NovaDudely 4y ago

As much as we can blame elites for a lot of these issues - Sheer physical depletion of energy and resource per-capita is one of the big driving forces behind a lot of these things nowadays. Don't get me wrong, the elites are definitely making things a LOT worse but it is not entirely on them. If everyone in this world lived like the middle classes, we would strip the planet bare in no time. The middle class is probably going to be remembered as just a weird moment in time thanks to the great blow off of the petroleum age. The best thing those in power can do is try to organise for a society that doesn't require as much consumption.

nwienert 4y ago
Just reduce population, the framing that falling population is a bad thing is a fallacy and possibly the most important one to debunk in our time.
- NovaDudely 4y ago
  Absolutely we need to reduce our population, how we do this in a smart and effective way.. I don't know. But by hook or by crook it is going to happen - I suspect entirely by crook. A good example would be the 'Limits to growth' study. I know they are just models but they are useful tools for thinking with. The last 6 models were all of ways to steady the population but most of them showed that the action needed had to be taken in the 1970 til 2000 to have nay hope. As Dennis Meadows said himself, he made the mistake of living long enough to see this study start to come true.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]