5 ms·

Wait why is that a problem? Nationality and ethnicity are two different things.

by dumpster_fire 4y ago

duxup 4y ago
I don't think / didn't say it was a problem.
- dumpster_fire 4y ago
  Someone married an Asian whose family happened to be ethnic Chinese, which made you think "huh these people are everywhere". (With regards to the diaspora comment) Then the comment, paraphrasing, "they think they're Chinese when they're not Chinese nationals at all". If their ancestors were from China, they don't "think" they're ethnic Chinese, they are ethnic Chinese. Unless you get into the nitty gritty clans and groups of the gigantic landmass. The use of "think ... although" indicates you disagree with how they identify their ethnicity. Thus I assumed you felt it was a problem. Apologies if I read intentions that weren't there.
  - cushychicken 4y ago
    I think OP meant he was surprised that the family felt a strong enough link to China to identify themselves as Chinese, even across time and distance.
    - dumpster_fire 4y ago
      Calling it a strong enough link is giving it too much credit. It's more of an acknowledgement of lineage. Not difficult when names, festivals, languages are retained. In fact, if you're within 3 generations of emigration, you would even know the province and town your great grandparents came from. Just as an example of something with a flimsier premise. Say a German American who doesn't speak the language, don't have known family there, have no loyalty to Germany, celebrate none of the German festivals, and the only indication left is a last name Schmidt. We don't say, "huh the German diaspora is everywhere" when these people say their ancestors are from Germany.
adastra22 4y ago
You are right, but most people don’t understand this.
xattt 4y ago
It’s a problem in that not a common way to perceive one’s identity and more difficult for others to relate to the situation. Consider the way Russians-in-exile perceive themselves in the current geopolitical context.
- Swizec 4y ago
  > It’s a problem in that not a common way to perceive one’s identity This is super common in Europe. We have people who think of themselves as X and speak Xian as their mother tongue even though the region has been part of Y country for centuries. Slovenians, for example, managed to survive under foreign rule for about 1100 years before re-gaining independence. Nationality and ethnicity are very different concepts. for a more American example: Ask any of the indigenous peoples how they feel about their American, Canadian, Mexican, etc. nationality.
- 5e92cb50239222b 4y ago
  It may not be common in your part of the world, it is extremely common in the former USSR (maybe because it was called "the prison of nations" or something to that effect). I am honestly surprised that anyone would have trouble understanding the difference between ethnicity and nationality as it seems very obvious to me and everyone I've ever met. > Consider the way Russians-in-exile perceive themselves in the current geopolitical context. Those who I've spoken to identify themselves as Russian citizens temporarily in exile, whilst I am ethnically Russian who has no connection to the country at all. I don't think these are the same.
concordDance 4y ago
They have the same name, which makes it confusing. E.g. if someone is French does that mean their ethnicity or their nationality?
- eloisant 4y ago
  That's a bad example because France isn't really an ethnicity. It's a group of regions that used to speak different languages even after World War II. You have Bretons that are ethnically close to Irish/Scotish, Alsaciens who are ethnically Germans, Basque who are similar to the Spanish Basque, Corse who want to be independent... A better example of a country that more or less encompass an ethnicity would be Germany, or Japan. But even there you'll find exceptions (Ainu in Hokkaido, Okinawa being also ethnically different as Ryukyu vs Yamato...)
  - concordDance 4y ago
    French is indeed an ethnicity in that there's a shared set of values, cultural traits and genes that you can distinguish from, say, the Greeks. The fact that it has substructure and blurred lines doesn't mean it isn't a valid abstraction.
- jacquesm 4y ago
  Some Basques may want a word, and some Corsicans, Bretons, Alsatians, Catalans and probably others as well.

Wait why is that a problem? Nationality and ethnicity are two different things.

duxup 4y ago

I don't think / didn't say it was a problem.

dumpster_fire 4y ago
Someone married an Asian whose family happened to be ethnic Chinese, which made you think "huh these people are everywhere". (With regards to the diaspora comment) Then the comment, paraphrasing, "they think they're Chinese when they're not Chinese nationals at all". If their ancestors were from China, they don't "think" they're ethnic Chinese, they are ethnic Chinese. Unless you get into the nitty gritty clans and groups of the gigantic landmass. The use of "think ... although" indicates you disagree with how they identify their ethnicity. Thus I assumed you felt it was a problem. Apologies if I read intentions that weren't there.
- cushychicken 4y ago
  I think OP meant he was surprised that the family felt a strong enough link to China to identify themselves as Chinese, even across time and distance.
  - dumpster_fire 4y ago
    Calling it a strong enough link is giving it too much credit. It's more of an acknowledgement of lineage. Not difficult when names, festivals, languages are retained. In fact, if you're within 3 generations of emigration, you would even know the province and town your great grandparents came from. Just as an example of something with a flimsier premise. Say a German American who doesn't speak the language, don't have known family there, have no loyalty to Germany, celebrate none of the German festivals, and the only indication left is a last name Schmidt. We don't say, "huh the German diaspora is everywhere" when these people say their ancestors are from Germany.

adastra22 4y ago

You are right, but most people don’t understand this.

xattt 4y ago

It’s a problem in that not a common way to perceive one’s identity and more difficult for others to relate to the situation. Consider the way Russians-in-exile perceive themselves in the current geopolitical context.

Swizec 4y ago
> It’s a problem in that not a common way to perceive one’s identity This is super common in Europe. We have people who think of themselves as X and speak Xian as their mother tongue even though the region has been part of Y country for centuries. Slovenians, for example, managed to survive under foreign rule for about 1100 years before re-gaining independence. Nationality and ethnicity are very different concepts. for a more American example: Ask any of the indigenous peoples how they feel about their American, Canadian, Mexican, etc. nationality.
5e92cb50239222b 4y ago
It may not be common in your part of the world, it is extremely common in the former USSR (maybe because it was called "the prison of nations" or something to that effect). I am honestly surprised that anyone would have trouble understanding the difference between ethnicity and nationality as it seems very obvious to me and everyone I've ever met. > Consider the way Russians-in-exile perceive themselves in the current geopolitical context. Those who I've spoken to identify themselves as Russian citizens temporarily in exile, whilst I am ethnically Russian who has no connection to the country at all. I don't think these are the same.

concordDance 4y ago

They have the same name, which makes it confusing. E.g. if someone is French does that mean their ethnicity or their nationality?

eloisant 4y ago
That's a bad example because France isn't really an ethnicity. It's a group of regions that used to speak different languages even after World War II. You have Bretons that are ethnically close to Irish/Scotish, Alsaciens who are ethnically Germans, Basque who are similar to the Spanish Basque, Corse who want to be independent... A better example of a country that more or less encompass an ethnicity would be Germany, or Japan. But even there you'll find exceptions (Ainu in Hokkaido, Okinawa being also ethnically different as Ryukyu vs Yamato...)
- concordDance 4y ago
  French is indeed an ethnicity in that there's a shared set of values, cultural traits and genes that you can distinguish from, say, the Greeks. The fact that it has substructure and blurred lines doesn't mean it isn't a valid abstraction.
jacquesm 4y ago
Some Basques may want a word, and some Corsicans, Bretons, Alsatians, Catalans and probably others as well.