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I feel the same way, but I know that moving to Linux isn't for me. My approach has been to run a Hackintosh, which provides excellent compatibility, reliability

I feel the same way, but I know that moving to Linux isn't for me. My approach has been to run a Hackintosh, which provides excellent compatibility, reliability and parts availability, and resist upgrading macOS at every major update. I'm currently still on 10.14 and haven't been forced off it yet, and maybe never will. Generally, if something requires a more recent version, I just reject it. There tends to be a positive correlation between the quality of software and the age of minimum OS requirements anyway. An interesting thing to note is that even with software that states support for an older version of the OS, it usually is more buggy, so there is a tendency for software to degrade over time as it gets updated.

andybak 4y ago
That's odd - I'd prefer the opposite tradeoff. Apple hardware is excellent but for me their software design choices are usually the problem. Even the much-lauded excellence in UX doesn't really hold up any more. But at least you can close the lid on a Macbook, put it in your bag and be secure in the knowledge it won't decide to switch on and probably cause permanent heat damage to itself. (looking at you windows...)
- dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
  > But at least you can close the lid on a Macbook ... Macs have the same issue, but you can turn off the feature that causes it.
  - post_below 4y ago
    You can turn it off in Windows too, though it it takes a few minutes and requires some knowledge (or Googling).
    - dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
      My understanding is that you had to go into the BIOS to do it, if turning it off was supported at all.
      - post_below 4y ago
        Maybe you're referring to whether or not the core ability to wake from sleep can be disabled? I've never tried to do that, so I can't say. In my experience you can reliably stop windows from waking in unwanted ways. I usually disable everything except input devices (keyboard, mouse).
        dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
        No that's not it. The issue is actually pretty involved, there is a LTT video on it, this is the bit I'm remembering: https://youtu.be/OHKKcd3sx2c?t=475 https://youtu.be/OHKKcd3sx2c?t=475
        post_below 4y ago
        Ah I see... you can disable network waking, also the ability of Windows Update to wake the computer. That, combined with disabling wake in other areas, solves it on various Windows computers I've tried it on. I guess it's possible that all of them were defaulting to S3 sleep though, I never checked.
  - wyclif 4y ago
    How do you turn it off?
    - dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
      It's in System Preferences somewhere (good luck). It's the option to allow software updates while your machine is asleep.
      - phforms 4y ago
        In Ventura (13.2), you can turn off automatic updates in the “General” tab, then “Software Update” and click on the little “(i)” icon to the right of “Automatic updates”. When I saw it the first time, it was unclear to me that I can even click on it, since it doesn’t look much like a button. They shouldn’t hide such important settings in a tiny icon or at least should have made it much more apparent that it is clickable. Couldn’t find any settings related to the closed lid though.
        dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
        It's actually "Wake for network access" setting, see here: https://youtu.be/OHKKcd3sx2c?t=349 https://youtu.be/OHKKcd3sx2c?t=349
        wyclif 4y ago
        Thanks for pointing to that. I don't think I've ever checked this setting, but I just did and in the latest macOS it's located in System Settings>Battery>Options>Wake for network access>Only on Power Adapter and it was already set so I'm good. Hmmm. I don't remember ever changing it from the default.

andybak 4y ago

That's odd - I'd prefer the opposite tradeoff. Apple hardware is excellent but for me their software design choices are usually the problem. Even the much-lauded excellence in UX doesn't really hold up any more. But at least you can close the lid on a Macbook, put it in your bag and be secure in the knowledge it won't decide to switch on and probably cause permanent heat damage to itself. (looking at you windows...)

dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
> But at least you can close the lid on a Macbook ... Macs have the same issue, but you can turn off the feature that causes it.
- post_below 4y ago
  You can turn it off in Windows too, though it it takes a few minutes and requires some knowledge (or Googling).
  - dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
    My understanding is that you had to go into the BIOS to do it, if turning it off was supported at all.
    - post_below 4y ago
      Maybe you're referring to whether or not the core ability to wake from sleep can be disabled? I've never tried to do that, so I can't say. In my experience you can reliably stop windows from waking in unwanted ways. I usually disable everything except input devices (keyboard, mouse).
      - dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
        No that's not it. The issue is actually pretty involved, there is a LTT video on it, this is the bit I'm remembering: https://youtu.be/OHKKcd3sx2c?t=475 https://youtu.be/OHKKcd3sx2c?t=475
        post_below 4y ago
        Ah I see... you can disable network waking, also the ability of Windows Update to wake the computer. That, combined with disabling wake in other areas, solves it on various Windows computers I've tried it on. I guess it's possible that all of them were defaulting to S3 sleep though, I never checked.
- wyclif 4y ago
  How do you turn it off?
  - dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
    It's in System Preferences somewhere (good luck). It's the option to allow software updates while your machine is asleep.
    - phforms 4y ago
      In Ventura (13.2), you can turn off automatic updates in the “General” tab, then “Software Update” and click on the little “(i)” icon to the right of “Automatic updates”. When I saw it the first time, it was unclear to me that I can even click on it, since it doesn’t look much like a button. They shouldn’t hide such important settings in a tiny icon or at least should have made it much more apparent that it is clickable. Couldn’t find any settings related to the closed lid though.
      - dkjaudyeqooe 4y ago
        It's actually "Wake for network access" setting, see here: https://youtu.be/OHKKcd3sx2c?t=349 https://youtu.be/OHKKcd3sx2c?t=349
        wyclif 4y ago
        Thanks for pointing to that. I don't think I've ever checked this setting, but I just did and in the latest macOS it's located in System Settings>Battery>Options>Wake for network access>Only on Power Adapter and it was already set so I'm good. Hmmm. I don't remember ever changing it from the default.