3 ms·

> That does not apply to women, because they are gorgeous, and we should not tell them what to do. I am baffled how you took that away from the article. Did we

> That does not apply to women, because they are gorgeous, and we should not tell them what to do. I am baffled how you took that away from the article. Did we read the same thing? This is what they had to say about the results for women. > As for why the results in women were not significant, Dr Spiegel and her colleagues theorise that sleep affects female response to vaccines too but that hormone interference, driven by varying stages of the menstrual cycle, contraception and hormone-replacement therapies, is probably altering immune response in profound and unknown ways that throw off the results. It is a subject area that urgently needs more attention, argue the researchers. ???

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
SamoyedFurFluff 4y ago
Wait, hormone replacement therapies in women? I don’t understand this one. If we are referring to transgender women, I think they’re like less than 1% of the population or something so it doesn’t make sense to rule out all women for an outlier. If we are referring to menopausal women, I don’t believe hormone replacement for menopause is very popular (I heard it causes health problems??). Also don’t men also get hormone replacement, ie they use steroids to get buff but also increasingly the concern of being low-testosterone has caused an increase of men supplementing testosterone especially when older?
- aww_dang 4y ago
  Perhaps it was a reference to birth control.
  - azalemeth 4y ago
    The menopause or perimenopausal period, more like.
  - AlecSchueler 4y ago
    Sometimes it's frightening to see what a male centric community HN is but this is hilarious.
    - ben_w 4y ago
      As a guy, sad more than funny. My sex ed at (UK Catholic) school was terrible and I can't really say I know any better than the rest of the comments here, despite both curiosity and actually asking questions when dating women. (Without asking cis women, I wouldn't have guessed that low BMI can inhibit periods, nor that The Pill can sometimes make periods worse rather than better, nor the ways the implant can go wrong; and without knowing a trans woman specifically I wouldn't have found out about different bone density, though I can't remember how that came up in conversation now as she and I never dated). It is a bad thing that so many men don't/didn't get taught about the lived experiences of (just over) half the population, and are/have been just expected to find them alien and impossible to understand.
  - ben_w 4y ago
    The researchers[0] listed that with an "and" rather than a "for example". > varying stages of the menstrual cycle, contraception and hormone-replacement therapies [0] or at least the @JusticeJuice quotation, as the free version of the article doesn't contain the link to the actual research paper…
    - JusticeJuice 4y ago
      https://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822(23)00156-2#secsectitle0015 https://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822(23)... From the paper's discussion > Given that sex impacts the response to vaccine,9,25 we calculated separate overall ES for men and women. When sleep was assessed objectively, the pooled ES was large and highly significant for men, whereas it was smaller and not significant for women, likely due to the wide variations in sex hormone levels according to phase of the menstrual cycle, use of hormonal contraception, menopausal status, and use of hormonal replacement in post-menopausal women.25 None of the studies included in our meta-analysis controlled for these known hormonal modulators of immune function.
      - ben_w 4y ago
        Thanks! :)
- dontlaugh 4y ago
  Hormone replacement is common treatment for menopause, but indeed for some women it’s not an option due to particularly bad side effects. Men don’t typically need hormone replacement in old age, testosterone production rarely drops much, if at all. It’s why we grow bald, after all.
  - Reason077 4y ago
    Testosterone absolutely declines in men, but it's gradual over your lifetime rather than a rapid change like the menopause. Typically, T peaks in your late teens, then declines around 1-2% per year for the rest of your life.
    - sandworm101 4y ago
      Until you qualify as "low T". They the docs prescribe you enough testosterone supplement that to you get bored with golf and start power lifting. You ain't "juicing" if your doctor is the one selling the pills.
    - dontlaugh 4y ago
      Sure. It’s also comparatively small drop that rarely needs treatment.
- ntlk 4y ago
  HRT for menopause is very common. “Around 15% of women aged 45 to 64 in England are currently prescribed HRT, which has increased rapidly in the last 2 years from around 11% and continues to increase.” as per https://www.gov.uk/government/news/hundreds-of-thousands-of-women-experiencing-menopause-symptoms-to-get-cheaper-hormone-replacement-therapy https://www.gov.uk/government/news/hundreds-of-thousands-of-...
  - SamoyedFurFluff 4y ago
    Oh TIl thanks. I thought hrt for menopause was quite rare

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

SamoyedFurFluff 4y ago

Wait, hormone replacement therapies in women? I don’t understand this one. If we are referring to transgender women, I think they’re like less than 1% of the population or something so it doesn’t make sense to rule out all women for an outlier. If we are referring to menopausal women, I don’t believe hormone replacement for menopause is very popular (I heard it causes health problems??). Also don’t men also get hormone replacement, ie they use steroids to get buff but also increasingly the concern of being low-testosterone has caused an increase of men supplementing testosterone especially when older?

aww_dang 4y ago
Perhaps it was a reference to birth control.
- azalemeth 4y ago
  The menopause or perimenopausal period, more like.
- AlecSchueler 4y ago
  Sometimes it's frightening to see what a male centric community HN is but this is hilarious.
  - ben_w 4y ago
    As a guy, sad more than funny. My sex ed at (UK Catholic) school was terrible and I can't really say I know any better than the rest of the comments here, despite both curiosity and actually asking questions when dating women. (Without asking cis women, I wouldn't have guessed that low BMI can inhibit periods, nor that The Pill can sometimes make periods worse rather than better, nor the ways the implant can go wrong; and without knowing a trans woman specifically I wouldn't have found out about different bone density, though I can't remember how that came up in conversation now as she and I never dated). It is a bad thing that so many men don't/didn't get taught about the lived experiences of (just over) half the population, and are/have been just expected to find them alien and impossible to understand.
- ben_w 4y ago
  The researchers[0] listed that with an "and" rather than a "for example". > varying stages of the menstrual cycle, contraception and hormone-replacement therapies [0] or at least the @JusticeJuice quotation, as the free version of the article doesn't contain the link to the actual research paper…
  - JusticeJuice 4y ago
    https://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822(23)00156-2#secsectitle0015 https://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822(23)... From the paper's discussion > Given that sex impacts the response to vaccine,9,25 we calculated separate overall ES for men and women. When sleep was assessed objectively, the pooled ES was large and highly significant for men, whereas it was smaller and not significant for women, likely due to the wide variations in sex hormone levels according to phase of the menstrual cycle, use of hormonal contraception, menopausal status, and use of hormonal replacement in post-menopausal women.25 None of the studies included in our meta-analysis controlled for these known hormonal modulators of immune function.
    - ben_w 4y ago
      Thanks! :)
dontlaugh 4y ago
Hormone replacement is common treatment for menopause, but indeed for some women it’s not an option due to particularly bad side effects. Men don’t typically need hormone replacement in old age, testosterone production rarely drops much, if at all. It’s why we grow bald, after all.
- Reason077 4y ago
  Testosterone absolutely declines in men, but it's gradual over your lifetime rather than a rapid change like the menopause. Typically, T peaks in your late teens, then declines around 1-2% per year for the rest of your life.
  - sandworm101 4y ago
    Until you qualify as "low T". They the docs prescribe you enough testosterone supplement that to you get bored with golf and start power lifting. You ain't "juicing" if your doctor is the one selling the pills.
  - dontlaugh 4y ago
    Sure. It’s also comparatively small drop that rarely needs treatment.
ntlk 4y ago
HRT for menopause is very common. “Around 15% of women aged 45 to 64 in England are currently prescribed HRT, which has increased rapidly in the last 2 years from around 11% and continues to increase.” as per https://www.gov.uk/government/news/hundreds-of-thousands-of-women-experiencing-menopause-symptoms-to-get-cheaper-hormone-replacement-therapy https://www.gov.uk/government/news/hundreds-of-thousands-of-...
- SamoyedFurFluff 4y ago
  Oh TIl thanks. I thought hrt for menopause was quite rare