4 ms·

Now that the tech bubble and hoarding of tech talent by big tech has ended, what is the future of these coding bootcamps? It seems just like many businesses tha

by npalli 4y ago

Now that the tech bubble and hoarding of tech talent by big tech has ended, what is the future of these coding bootcamps? It seems just like many businesses that get started during low/zero interest times, this was clearly a boom time phenomena - take advantage of the desperate need of companies to hire talent and match that with talent who didn't want to spend a long time learning (college or otherwise) and wanted to fast track a high paying job. Demand (companies) has dried up and turns out you cannot easily get into a tech job doing some simple cookie cutter courses.

giraffe_lady 4y ago
I was involved with one of the more reputable code schools a few years ago, my information is out of date and not necessarily representative but firsthand. It's not really true that the students at these were trying to fast-track into highly paid jobs per se. Half or more were skilled professionals with masters degrees. A lot of high-burnout fields represented: disproportionate (and alarming) number of teachers and nurses in there, as well as like ex-goldman analysts, tons of mechanical and civil engineers as well. Everyone assumes these were full of like, bartenders chasing money (which there is nothing wrong with that either) but in my experience it wasn't true at all. It was mostly late 20s-early 30s professionals who were looking to change to another skilled career, mostly due to burnout, poor fit in the first one, or more autonomy. > turns out you cannot easily get into a tech job doing some simple cookie cutter courses. No, you can't easily get into a tech job from these courses. But more interesting to me it showed that you can do a tech job from doing these courses. I've worked with code school grads a lot after that as well, in fact I seek them out when hiring. It's true that a fresh code school grad has a narrow slice of competence and needs more and different kinds of support than other junior devs. But they can succeed if given it, and ones a couple years or more into their careers tend to punch well above their weight in my experience. It's a group that is basically self-selecting for confidence and calculated risk-taking. They do well.
- npalli 4y ago
  Thanks for sharing, good to know. I think it also speaks to the shady underside of the coding camps that they always seem to advertise some random person doing some side jobs, then they do a coding bootcamp and boom! they are into tech. Literally a couple of days ago[1], Austen Allred (the guy running BloomTech getting sued) was tweeting how some housewife has landed a tech job after being out of the workforce for 15 years. People would be lot more careful if they knew that 1/2 the cohort is people with Master's degrees. [1] https://twitter.com/Austen/status/1636176434380296194 https://twitter.com/Austen/status/1636176434380296194
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - pavlov 4y ago
    A housewife out of the workforce for 15 years can have a master’s degree…
- Karrot_Kream 4y ago
  > Everyone assumes these were full of like, bartenders chasing money (which there is nothing wrong with that either) but in my experience it wasn't true at all. It was mostly late 20s-early 30s professionals who were looking to change to another skilled career, mostly due to burnout, poor fit in the first one, or more autonomy. Yeah I was surprised when I realized most of the bootcamp grads I met were elite school graduates in things like BioE or Industrial Engineering who wanted to transition to tech. They had worked in their fields and wanted a change so they had the money saved up to do a bootcamp. It was no surprise to me that they did well in tech as they were already from STEM programs in great schools anyway. I've heard anecdotally (no real proof) that later cohorts started drawing more of the "bartender chasing money" types (again nothing wrong with them) which made the competition for the schools a lot harder.
waboremo 4y ago
>easily get into a tech job doing some simple cookie cutter courses. This is still done. It's called college, only takes 3 years.
- arroz 4y ago
  A college is much better than a bootcamp
  - barry-cotter 4y ago
    Indeed, one acculturates you to the middle class and the other at best gets you a well paying job. Only the working class would think they were comparable in some way.
- peanuty1 4y ago
  Don't bachelor's degrees take four years unless you bring AP credits in with you?
  - bodhiandphysics 4y ago
    not if you already have one! In general, a second bachelors in the US and Canada requires 60 credits, or two years of studies. Schools generally don't require you to redo gen ed requirements. This is important to consider, since many boot camp graduates, including many of the most successful ones already have a degree.
thenerdhead 4y ago
How has it ended? Companies are going through a strategic inflection point with AI. When that stabilizes over the next decade(couple years probably), hiring will boom again. Demand is only temporarily dried up due to navigating rough seas and aligning internally. Read Only the Paranoid Survive and you’ll see the same thing happening today. Bootcamps will still be needed as new tech needs to be learned quickly to fill vacant positions.

by npalli 4y ago

giraffe_lady 4y ago

I was involved with one of the more reputable code schools a few years ago, my information is out of date and not necessarily representative but firsthand. It's not really true that the students at these were trying to fast-track into highly paid jobs per se. Half or more were skilled professionals with masters degrees. A lot of high-burnout fields represented: disproportionate (and alarming) number of teachers and nurses in there, as well as like ex-goldman analysts, tons of mechanical and civil engineers as well. Everyone assumes these were full of like, bartenders chasing money (which there is nothing wrong with that either) but in my experience it wasn't true at all. It was mostly late 20s-early 30s professionals who were looking to change to another skilled career, mostly due to burnout, poor fit in the first one, or more autonomy. > turns out you cannot easily get into a tech job doing some simple cookie cutter courses. No, you can't easily get into a tech job from these courses. But more interesting to me it showed that you can do a tech job from doing these courses. I've worked with code school grads a lot after that as well, in fact I seek them out when hiring. It's true that a fresh code school grad has a narrow slice of competence and needs more and different kinds of support than other junior devs. But they can succeed if given it, and ones a couple years or more into their careers tend to punch well above their weight in my experience. It's a group that is basically self-selecting for confidence and calculated risk-taking. They do well.

npalli 4y ago
Thanks for sharing, good to know. I think it also speaks to the shady underside of the coding camps that they always seem to advertise some random person doing some side jobs, then they do a coding bootcamp and boom! they are into tech. Literally a couple of days ago[1], Austen Allred (the guy running BloomTech getting sued) was tweeting how some housewife has landed a tech job after being out of the workforce for 15 years. People would be lot more careful if they knew that 1/2 the cohort is people with Master's degrees. [1] https://twitter.com/Austen/status/1636176434380296194 https://twitter.com/Austen/status/1636176434380296194
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- pavlov 4y ago
  A housewife out of the workforce for 15 years can have a master’s degree…
Karrot_Kream 4y ago
> Everyone assumes these were full of like, bartenders chasing money (which there is nothing wrong with that either) but in my experience it wasn't true at all. It was mostly late 20s-early 30s professionals who were looking to change to another skilled career, mostly due to burnout, poor fit in the first one, or more autonomy. Yeah I was surprised when I realized most of the bootcamp grads I met were elite school graduates in things like BioE or Industrial Engineering who wanted to transition to tech. They had worked in their fields and wanted a change so they had the money saved up to do a bootcamp. It was no surprise to me that they did well in tech as they were already from STEM programs in great schools anyway. I've heard anecdotally (no real proof) that later cohorts started drawing more of the "bartender chasing money" types (again nothing wrong with them) which made the competition for the schools a lot harder.

waboremo 4y ago

>easily get into a tech job doing some simple cookie cutter courses. This is still done. It's called college, only takes 3 years.

arroz 4y ago
A college is much better than a bootcamp
- barry-cotter 4y ago
  Indeed, one acculturates you to the middle class and the other at best gets you a well paying job. Only the working class would think they were comparable in some way.
peanuty1 4y ago
Don't bachelor's degrees take four years unless you bring AP credits in with you?
- bodhiandphysics 4y ago
  not if you already have one! In general, a second bachelors in the US and Canada requires 60 credits, or two years of studies. Schools generally don't require you to redo gen ed requirements. This is important to consider, since many boot camp graduates, including many of the most successful ones already have a degree.

thenerdhead 4y ago

How has it ended? Companies are going through a strategic inflection point with AI. When that stabilizes over the next decade(couple years probably), hiring will boom again. Demand is only temporarily dried up due to navigating rough seas and aligning internally. Read Only the Paranoid Survive and you’ll see the same thing happening today. Bootcamps will still be needed as new tech needs to be learned quickly to fill vacant positions.