4 ms·

MDs require more school on top of college; their major is often unrelated except they have to take pre-med classes. Often times people will go back to a communi

MDs require more school on top of college; their major is often unrelated except they have to take pre-med classes. Often times people will go back to a community college or some other schooling option for those classes if they decide they want to go down that route. So you absolutely can be any of those majors and change your position later. Far better than say a communications major, which with psychology are the two main majors for people who are in college but don’t know what to focus on. You can self-educate but very, very few have the capacity to get anywhere near what you’d get from a dedicated professional walking you through a curriculum in a context where you’re dedicating 4 years to the endeavor. Of course not everyone “needs” to be more educated to have a functional life, but society is much better off when more of the public is educated. You can look around the world at the varying results of that, and it’s consequences.

waboremo 4y ago
Those that can self-educate effectively are also ones that would thrive in a proper high education system. Unfortunately, we're turning them away for various reasons (financial, lack of flexibility, etc) and filling rooms full of people who are there just because they were told to be there. It's quite horrendous, people in their 3+ years and they're still just going through the motions for the paper. If you're not there to network and find a job, you're the odd one out. This idea of treating these institutions as places for continual higher learning is just not the norm. It's an interesting predicament, more education for everyone is better, yet our designation of colleges/universities as the "last" required tier has stunted many people in many ways.
- deleted 4y ago
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- mtrower 4y ago
  > Those that can self-educate effectively are also ones that would thrive in a proper high education system. That might depend on what you define as 'proper'. These environments are typically tailored toward a certain median individual and if you don't fit that median (above or below), you aren't going to have a good time. In my own experience, I can generally self-educate far better than what I've found in any traditional educational environment available* to me. I just can't deal with the snail's pace of concept introduction, the shallowness of concept exploration, etc. Everything moves so slow and I just tune it out. * What I've seen of MIT's open courseware appeared interesting and well-paced to me, but that's not a route that was ever available to me.
- ZephyrBlu 4y ago
  > Those that can self-educate effectively are also ones that would thrive in a proper high education system Disagree. I think it's the complete opposite. Higher education is way to structured and inflexible.
mfer 4y ago
> society is much better off when more of the public is educated. To what extent of educated? What do you mean by educated? A lot of what the general public gets isn't deep thought. It's being told what to think. A lot of the what to think is ideas based on assumptions and beliefs. Are people better off for learning them? For those who want to think deeply, are modern colleges a place that allow for that? I know PhDs who no longer teach because there is a lack of intellectualism and too much indoctrination. A dedicated professor telling me what to think (their ideas) rather than teaching me how to think and navigate the space well... for general things... may not be so useful to society.
- azinman2 4y ago
  > A lot of what the general public gets isn't deep thought. It's being told what to think. A lot of the what to think is ideas based on assumptions and beliefs. Are people better off for learning them? Yes because what it would be replaced with is even worse and likely instantly falls apart under a modicum of critical thinking.
  - mtrower 4y ago
    That's just indoctrination. Great I guess if you agree with the brainwashing. Not so great if you're on the other side.
    - Dudeman112 4y ago
      Yes, there's a big overlap between "learning" and "indoctrination". For mysterious reasons we only care about not being indoctrination when it comes to adults or almost adults People wouldn't learn anything if they had to deeply understand and verify every part by themselves before moving on Great I guess if you're happy with most of society never moving too far past what's covered in the first stretch of middle school
      - mtrower 4y ago
        > Yes, there's a big overlap between "learning" and "indoctrination". Perhaps if you subscribe to the "chinese master" mentality. I never had much regard for this. > For mysterious reasons we only care about not being indoctrination when it comes to adults or almost adults Uh. I sure gave a damn for all of my memorable life --- literally since at least 4 years of age. I don't know about you. > People wouldn't learn anything if they had to deeply understand and verify every part by themselves before moving on This is true to some extent of everyone, but I always tried to think for myself as much as possible. Actually, it earned me a lot of scorn and ire, for not just following the herd... > Great I guess if you're happy with most of society never moving too far past what's covered in the first stretch of middle school If by middle school you mean social pressure to conform... well, I'd say we want the opposite of that. If you mean that without indoctrination, people won't move past middle school in terms of knowledge... well, I would argue that most people don't seem to retain most of what they learned in middle school and high school to begin with... hell, that's basically the first half of college right there, just re-hashing those same topics...
mtrower 4y ago
> a dedicated professional walking you through a curriculum in a context where you’re dedicating 4 years to the endeavor. Sounds nice. What I've actually seen is dedicated professionals walking entire classes en masse through curriculum --- a very different situation.

waboremo 4y ago

Those that can self-educate effectively are also ones that would thrive in a proper high education system. Unfortunately, we're turning them away for various reasons (financial, lack of flexibility, etc) and filling rooms full of people who are there just because they were told to be there. It's quite horrendous, people in their 3+ years and they're still just going through the motions for the paper. If you're not there to network and find a job, you're the odd one out. This idea of treating these institutions as places for continual higher learning is just not the norm. It's an interesting predicament, more education for everyone is better, yet our designation of colleges/universities as the "last" required tier has stunted many people in many ways.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
mtrower 4y ago
> Those that can self-educate effectively are also ones that would thrive in a proper high education system. That might depend on what you define as 'proper'. These environments are typically tailored toward a certain median individual and if you don't fit that median (above or below), you aren't going to have a good time. In my own experience, I can generally self-educate far better than what I've found in any traditional educational environment available* to me. I just can't deal with the snail's pace of concept introduction, the shallowness of concept exploration, etc. Everything moves so slow and I just tune it out. * What I've seen of MIT's open courseware appeared interesting and well-paced to me, but that's not a route that was ever available to me.
ZephyrBlu 4y ago
> Those that can self-educate effectively are also ones that would thrive in a proper high education system Disagree. I think it's the complete opposite. Higher education is way to structured and inflexible.

mfer 4y ago

> society is much better off when more of the public is educated. To what extent of educated? What do you mean by educated? A lot of what the general public gets isn't deep thought. It's being told what to think. A lot of the what to think is ideas based on assumptions and beliefs. Are people better off for learning them? For those who want to think deeply, are modern colleges a place that allow for that? I know PhDs who no longer teach because there is a lack of intellectualism and too much indoctrination. A dedicated professor telling me what to think (their ideas) rather than teaching me how to think and navigate the space well... for general things... may not be so useful to society.

azinman2 4y ago
> A lot of what the general public gets isn't deep thought. It's being told what to think. A lot of the what to think is ideas based on assumptions and beliefs. Are people better off for learning them? Yes because what it would be replaced with is even worse and likely instantly falls apart under a modicum of critical thinking.
- mtrower 4y ago
  That's just indoctrination. Great I guess if you agree with the brainwashing. Not so great if you're on the other side.
  - Dudeman112 4y ago
    Yes, there's a big overlap between "learning" and "indoctrination". For mysterious reasons we only care about not being indoctrination when it comes to adults or almost adults People wouldn't learn anything if they had to deeply understand and verify every part by themselves before moving on Great I guess if you're happy with most of society never moving too far past what's covered in the first stretch of middle school
    - mtrower 4y ago
      > Yes, there's a big overlap between "learning" and "indoctrination". Perhaps if you subscribe to the "chinese master" mentality. I never had much regard for this. > For mysterious reasons we only care about not being indoctrination when it comes to adults or almost adults Uh. I sure gave a damn for all of my memorable life --- literally since at least 4 years of age. I don't know about you. > People wouldn't learn anything if they had to deeply understand and verify every part by themselves before moving on This is true to some extent of everyone, but I always tried to think for myself as much as possible. Actually, it earned me a lot of scorn and ire, for not just following the herd... > Great I guess if you're happy with most of society never moving too far past what's covered in the first stretch of middle school If by middle school you mean social pressure to conform... well, I'd say we want the opposite of that. If you mean that without indoctrination, people won't move past middle school in terms of knowledge... well, I would argue that most people don't seem to retain most of what they learned in middle school and high school to begin with... hell, that's basically the first half of college right there, just re-hashing those same topics...

mtrower 4y ago

> a dedicated professional walking you through a curriculum in a context where you’re dedicating 4 years to the endeavor. Sounds nice. What I've actually seen is dedicated professionals walking entire classes en masse through curriculum --- a very different situation.