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>Kyiv regime isn't Ukranian I'm not actually arguing that. However: Zelensky was elected largely by the voters in the eastern regions of Ukraine, and largely b

by D_Alex 4y ago

>Kyiv regime isn't Ukranian I'm not actually arguing that. However: Zelensky was elected largely by the voters in the eastern regions of Ukraine, and largely because he promised to bring peace to those regions. He has failed in that promise and betrayed his voters. Most likely because of Western influence. >Putin sees the Kyiv regime as Western ... ... he says so in the speech I linked above.... etc. I read the entire thing and I don't see it. Which paragraph are you talking about? Is it this one: "...the leading NATO countries are supporting the far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis in Ukraine, those who will never forgive the people of Crimea and Sevastopol for freely making a choice to reunite with Russia. They will undoubtedly try to bring war to Crimea just as they have done in Donbass..." because that's certainly not about "Ukrainians" in the sense that you keep on implying. >Could you answer if you believe the Kyiv regime is Ukranian? Let me try. The current Kiev regime is made up of Ukrainian nationals. However, it is no longer acting in the interests of Ukrainian people. It has become a sock puppet of the NATO countries. So I believe that it is "Ukrainian" in the same sense that the ruling party of China is "communist" or that Donald Trump is a "conservative". Hope that answers your question.

vel0city 4y ago
Putin sees the Kyiv regime as Westernized. He doesn't directly state this as a single line, but you don't need to look too deep in his statements to understand this. Unless you're thinking he's talking about someone else when talking about far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis here. "Focused on their own goals, the leading NATO countries are supporting the far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis in Ukraine, those who will never forgive the people of Crimea and Sevastopol for freely making a choice to reunite with Russia." "Any further expansion of the North Atlantic alliance’s infrastructure or the ongoing efforts to gain a military foothold of the Ukrainian territory are unacceptable for us." What foothold would he be talking about here if not a Westernization of the regime in Kyiv? "...are supporting the far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis in Ukraine" > because that's certainly not about "Ukrainians" in the sense that you keep on implying. What nationality are those people who are those "far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis in Ukraine"? Isn't he referring to the regime in Kyiv and its supporters with this language? Is Zelenskyy not a Ukrainian? Are those people in the Ukrainian army with the Ukrainian flag on their uniforms not Ukrainian? What nationality are those nationalists supposedly fighting for? Talk about gaslighting.
- D_Alex 4y ago
  >Putin sees the Kyiv regime as Westernized. He doesn't directly state this as a single line... If you dismiss what he is saying directly, and look for some obscure meaning instead, with some help of semantic distortion you will find what you want to find. >What foothold would he be talking about here Very obviously NATO foothold, that's the "North Atlantic alliance". >What nationality are those people who are those "far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis in Ukraine"?... etc. They are Ukrainians. And Ku Klux Klan members are American. But you can't interchange the terms willy-nilly. Eg it is wrong to say "Americans advocate the use of violence against people of colour and Jews".
  - vel0city 4y ago
    "...the leading NATO countries are supporting the far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis in Ukraine, those who will never forgive the people of Crimea and Sevastopol for freely making a choice to reunite with Russia." > And Ku Klux Klan members are American. But you can't interchange the terms willy-nilly. Eg it is wrong to say "Americans advocate the use of violence against people of colour and Jews". Those leading NATO countries are supporting the regime in Kyiv, the government headed by Zelenskyy, which he also "will never forgive the people of Crimea and Sevastopol for freely making a choice to reunite with Russia." Ergo, by Putin's own words, Zelenskyy == a far right nationalist/neo-Nazi. If I say a rectangle is a four sided shape with all right angles, and describe a shape with four sides and all right angles, I just called it rectangle without actually using that word directly, right? This is very different from your example with the KKK, as the leaders of the KKK aren't currently the leadership of the US government. If the leadership of the US government was composed of largely KKK members and they started instituting KKK policies, I would agree with that statement. Are you seriously suggesting that Putin explicitly wasn't connecting Zelenskyy to the "far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis" here?
    - D_Alex 4y ago
      Hello again! >Those leading NATO countries are supporting the regime in Kyiv, the government headed by Zelenskyy Unfortunately, this is a misleading half-truth. The truth (this is my opinion, but based on literally hundreds of hours of scouring the internet for information) is that: 1) Zelensky was elected because Ukrainians, especially Eastern Ukrainians believed that he would work to bring peace to Donbas; 2) For a year or so after his election, he actually tried to do that. The West disapproved and pressured him to change course, while the far right nationalists basically told him to f@#k off and made public death threats against him. I don't know if you understand Ukrainian, but at least skim these videos https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KxLuDpP4_w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KxLuDpP4_w / https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5RRDnF7lKM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5RRDnF7lKM to get an idea. I think Putin called Ukraine a failed state at that point. 3) After a while, Zelensky basically folded and let foreign backed parties and interests dictate Ukrainian policy. Ultimately leading to where we are today. So it is not so much that "leading NATO countries are supporting the regime in Kyiv". but rather "the regime in Kyiv is a NATO puppet regime". >This is very different ... Are you seriously suggesting that Putin explicitly wasn't connecting Zelenskyy to the "far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis" here? I'm certainly not suggesting that, quite the opposite. He was connecting the two, just not in the way you imply. He quite rightly IMO is saying that Zelensky is carrying out the agenda of far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis. But not "Ukrainians", meaning the people of Ukraine in general.

by D_Alex 4y ago

vel0city 4y ago

Putin sees the Kyiv regime as Westernized. He doesn't directly state this as a single line, but you don't need to look too deep in his statements to understand this. Unless you're thinking he's talking about someone else when talking about far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis here. "Focused on their own goals, the leading NATO countries are supporting the far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis in Ukraine, those who will never forgive the people of Crimea and Sevastopol for freely making a choice to reunite with Russia." "Any further expansion of the North Atlantic alliance’s infrastructure or the ongoing efforts to gain a military foothold of the Ukrainian territory are unacceptable for us." What foothold would he be talking about here if not a Westernization of the regime in Kyiv? "...are supporting the far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis in Ukraine" > because that's certainly not about "Ukrainians" in the sense that you keep on implying. What nationality are those people who are those "far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis in Ukraine"? Isn't he referring to the regime in Kyiv and its supporters with this language? Is Zelenskyy not a Ukrainian? Are those people in the Ukrainian army with the Ukrainian flag on their uniforms not Ukrainian? What nationality are those nationalists supposedly fighting for? Talk about gaslighting.

D_Alex 4y ago
>Putin sees the Kyiv regime as Westernized. He doesn't directly state this as a single line... If you dismiss what he is saying directly, and look for some obscure meaning instead, with some help of semantic distortion you will find what you want to find. >What foothold would he be talking about here Very obviously NATO foothold, that's the "North Atlantic alliance". >What nationality are those people who are those "far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis in Ukraine"?... etc. They are Ukrainians. And Ku Klux Klan members are American. But you can't interchange the terms willy-nilly. Eg it is wrong to say "Americans advocate the use of violence against people of colour and Jews".
- vel0city 4y ago
  "...the leading NATO countries are supporting the far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis in Ukraine, those who will never forgive the people of Crimea and Sevastopol for freely making a choice to reunite with Russia." > And Ku Klux Klan members are American. But you can't interchange the terms willy-nilly. Eg it is wrong to say "Americans advocate the use of violence against people of colour and Jews". Those leading NATO countries are supporting the regime in Kyiv, the government headed by Zelenskyy, which he also "will never forgive the people of Crimea and Sevastopol for freely making a choice to reunite with Russia." Ergo, by Putin's own words, Zelenskyy == a far right nationalist/neo-Nazi. If I say a rectangle is a four sided shape with all right angles, and describe a shape with four sides and all right angles, I just called it rectangle without actually using that word directly, right? This is very different from your example with the KKK, as the leaders of the KKK aren't currently the leadership of the US government. If the leadership of the US government was composed of largely KKK members and they started instituting KKK policies, I would agree with that statement. Are you seriously suggesting that Putin explicitly wasn't connecting Zelenskyy to the "far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis" here?
  - D_Alex 4y ago
    Hello again! >Those leading NATO countries are supporting the regime in Kyiv, the government headed by Zelenskyy Unfortunately, this is a misleading half-truth. The truth (this is my opinion, but based on literally hundreds of hours of scouring the internet for information) is that: 1) Zelensky was elected because Ukrainians, especially Eastern Ukrainians believed that he would work to bring peace to Donbas; 2) For a year or so after his election, he actually tried to do that. The West disapproved and pressured him to change course, while the far right nationalists basically told him to f@#k off and made public death threats against him. I don't know if you understand Ukrainian, but at least skim these videos https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KxLuDpP4_w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KxLuDpP4_w / https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5RRDnF7lKM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5RRDnF7lKM to get an idea. I think Putin called Ukraine a failed state at that point. 3) After a while, Zelensky basically folded and let foreign backed parties and interests dictate Ukrainian policy. Ultimately leading to where we are today. So it is not so much that "leading NATO countries are supporting the regime in Kyiv". but rather "the regime in Kyiv is a NATO puppet regime". >This is very different ... Are you seriously suggesting that Putin explicitly wasn't connecting Zelenskyy to the "far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis" here? I'm certainly not suggesting that, quite the opposite. He was connecting the two, just not in the way you imply. He quite rightly IMO is saying that Zelensky is carrying out the agenda of far-right nationalists and neo-Nazis. But not "Ukrainians", meaning the people of Ukraine in general.