4 ms·

Outside of the US this is pretty much how most hospitals operate. You get through the door, you get care.

s1artibartfast 4y ago
This is not how it works in any country on the planet. You do not walk through the door and get unlimited care of all types and for all diseases. Different countries have different methods for deciding who gets what care, and when they are cut off. You can argue which are better than others, but nowhere is it an all you can consume Buffet
- noodlesUK 4y ago
  I think what you're trying to say is that there are always limits to what care is available, and that the best possible care is not always provided due to resource constraints. There are of course always methods for determining who gets care, but at least as far as the UK goes, anyone who is legally resident in the UK can walk into a hospital and get largely the same healthcare as anyone else. If you're not legally resident in the UK (i.e., you're a visitor or undocumented), you will receive emergency care and primary care without charge, and you will only be charged if you're admitted to hospital. Many countries (including the EU) have arrangements so that their citizens/residents won't be charged even in those circumstances. Almost every developed country on the planet other than the US has universal healthcare. The notion that you will be cut off because you can't pay is the exception not the rule.
  - 908B64B197 4y ago
    > There are of course always methods for determining who gets care, but at least as far as the UK goes, anyone who is legally resident in the UK can walk into a hospital and get largely the same healthcare as anyone else. They are allowed the privilege of a multi-year waiting list for basic procedures (unless they happen to be high enough socially to rub elbows with doctors.)
    - dundarious 4y ago
      The waiting lists time increase over the last decade or so is unnecessary and scandalous, and the government should be held accountable.
  - s1artibartfast 4y ago
    My point was that the differences are more nuanced than presented. Most developed countries on the planet including the UK also have private insurance, which serves to give you different Healthcare options then what is covered by their socialized medicine systems. Anyone in the United States can walk into an emergency room and will not be denied treatment based on their lack of insurance. I'm not trying to argue that the US system is better, but point out that it is often compared to an idealized and imaginary European system that does not exist. Some people loudly Proclaim that citizens are entitled to any Healthcare they might need or want like in Europe. There is a lot more to it than that
  - robswc 4y ago
    >anyone who is legally resident in the UK can walk into a hospital and get largely the same healthcare as anyone else This is true in the US too. Hospitals don't just refuse care unless they consider you "well enough" which unfortunately happens sometimes but its not per policy. Same thing in the UK though... I know a guy who's next door neighbor's dad died because he couldn't get an ambulance or basically any "urgent care." Didn't have a car and they refused to send an ambulance for some reason. They called the police to try to get them to help but they were too late. I don't know the details but he was fuming mad about it.
0xy 4y ago
I guess that's why Canadian to US medical tourism is skyrocketing and growing at more than 50% a year, because as you say non-US free healthcare systems provide care on demand. The question is, why is the Canadian system crumbling so badly that patients flee to the US if it's so perfect?
- klyrs 4y ago
  There's two big problems with the Canadian system. The first is brain drain; doctors can make way more money in the US. The other is politics. Slashing taxes is a short-term political win, even if it has disastrous long-term consequences. The Canadian system is far from perfect. But nobody can match the waste in the US system.
  - 0xy 4y ago
    If the US system was so bad, you would not be seeing rising amounts of medical tourism to the country. Generally, when systems are bad, people flee it by any means necessary. Canadians come to the US because Canadian healthcare quality is garbage, or simply non-existent. Yeah, it's free, but have a rare or advanced cancer and you're on your own. The US has probably the best cancer treatment options in the entire world. It's not free, it's not perfect, but it's available. Canadian, European and other countries love to dunk on US healthcare by posting misleading information and pictures (omg look a $100,000 bill! [insurance pays it all]). Meanwhile, Canadian and Europe have death panels, 24 month waiting lists, no right to try experimental treatment, predatory euthanasia (18 year old has depression? sign here for suicide) and other atrocities.
    - klyrs 4y ago
      The US system is great if you're rich. Most citizens are not. The US system is bad, from the perspective of most of the people accessing it.
    - dredmorbius 4y ago
      Your argument is self-undermining. Those with the means to pay for US healthcare benefit from it. Those without are cut out of the system. Wealthy Canadian medical tourism doesn't any claims that access to US healthcare is highly inequitable. Equivalent medical tourism from the US is often to lower-income nations, most notably Mexico. Searching on "medical tourism", two different lists give top spots to Mexico and, suprising me, Canada. The US is included in neither. #1 Mexico: <https://medtouragency.com/best-countries-for-medical-tourism/ https://medtouragency.com/best-countries-for-medical-tourism...> #1 Canada: <https://www.healthgrades.com/pro/the-top-10-medical-tourism-destinations https://www.healthgrades.com/pro/the-top-10-medical-tourism-...> And a third, also giving #1 to Canada, and excluding the US from the top sixteen. Or, on clicking through to the full report, any of the 46-listed nations. <https://www.medicaltourism.com/mti/home https://www.medicaltourism.com/mti/home>
dudul 4y ago
It's the same in the US. All hospitals have an obligation to provide care. Source: my wife is a nurse and it happens all the time.

This is not how it works in any country on the planet. You do not walk through the door and get unlimited care of all types and for all diseases. Different countries have different methods for deciding who gets what care, and when they are cut off. You can argue which are better than others, but nowhere is it an all you can consume Buffet

noodlesUK 4y ago
I think what you're trying to say is that there are always limits to what care is available, and that the best possible care is not always provided due to resource constraints. There are of course always methods for determining who gets care, but at least as far as the UK goes, anyone who is legally resident in the UK can walk into a hospital and get largely the same healthcare as anyone else. If you're not legally resident in the UK (i.e., you're a visitor or undocumented), you will receive emergency care and primary care without charge, and you will only be charged if you're admitted to hospital. Many countries (including the EU) have arrangements so that their citizens/residents won't be charged even in those circumstances. Almost every developed country on the planet other than the US has universal healthcare. The notion that you will be cut off because you can't pay is the exception not the rule.
- 908B64B197 4y ago
  > There are of course always methods for determining who gets care, but at least as far as the UK goes, anyone who is legally resident in the UK can walk into a hospital and get largely the same healthcare as anyone else. They are allowed the privilege of a multi-year waiting list for basic procedures (unless they happen to be high enough socially to rub elbows with doctors.)
  - dundarious 4y ago
    The waiting lists time increase over the last decade or so is unnecessary and scandalous, and the government should be held accountable.
- s1artibartfast 4y ago
  My point was that the differences are more nuanced than presented. Most developed countries on the planet including the UK also have private insurance, which serves to give you different Healthcare options then what is covered by their socialized medicine systems. Anyone in the United States can walk into an emergency room and will not be denied treatment based on their lack of insurance. I'm not trying to argue that the US system is better, but point out that it is often compared to an idealized and imaginary European system that does not exist. Some people loudly Proclaim that citizens are entitled to any Healthcare they might need or want like in Europe. There is a lot more to it than that
- robswc 4y ago
  >anyone who is legally resident in the UK can walk into a hospital and get largely the same healthcare as anyone else This is true in the US too. Hospitals don't just refuse care unless they consider you "well enough" which unfortunately happens sometimes but its not per policy. Same thing in the UK though... I know a guy who's next door neighbor's dad died because he couldn't get an ambulance or basically any "urgent care." Didn't have a car and they refused to send an ambulance for some reason. They called the police to try to get them to help but they were too late. I don't know the details but he was fuming mad about it.

0xy 4y ago

I guess that's why Canadian to US medical tourism is skyrocketing and growing at more than 50% a year, because as you say non-US free healthcare systems provide care on demand. The question is, why is the Canadian system crumbling so badly that patients flee to the US if it's so perfect?

klyrs 4y ago
There's two big problems with the Canadian system. The first is brain drain; doctors can make way more money in the US. The other is politics. Slashing taxes is a short-term political win, even if it has disastrous long-term consequences. The Canadian system is far from perfect. But nobody can match the waste in the US system.
- 0xy 4y ago
  If the US system was so bad, you would not be seeing rising amounts of medical tourism to the country. Generally, when systems are bad, people flee it by any means necessary. Canadians come to the US because Canadian healthcare quality is garbage, or simply non-existent. Yeah, it's free, but have a rare or advanced cancer and you're on your own. The US has probably the best cancer treatment options in the entire world. It's not free, it's not perfect, but it's available. Canadian, European and other countries love to dunk on US healthcare by posting misleading information and pictures (omg look a $100,000 bill! [insurance pays it all]). Meanwhile, Canadian and Europe have death panels, 24 month waiting lists, no right to try experimental treatment, predatory euthanasia (18 year old has depression? sign here for suicide) and other atrocities.
  - klyrs 4y ago
    The US system is great if you're rich. Most citizens are not. The US system is bad, from the perspective of most of the people accessing it.
  - dredmorbius 4y ago
    Your argument is self-undermining. Those with the means to pay for US healthcare benefit from it. Those without are cut out of the system. Wealthy Canadian medical tourism doesn't any claims that access to US healthcare is highly inequitable. Equivalent medical tourism from the US is often to lower-income nations, most notably Mexico. Searching on "medical tourism", two different lists give top spots to Mexico and, suprising me, Canada. The US is included in neither. #1 Mexico: <https://medtouragency.com/best-countries-for-medical-tourism/ https://medtouragency.com/best-countries-for-medical-tourism...> #1 Canada: <https://www.healthgrades.com/pro/the-top-10-medical-tourism-destinations https://www.healthgrades.com/pro/the-top-10-medical-tourism-...> And a third, also giving #1 to Canada, and excluding the US from the top sixteen. Or, on clicking through to the full report, any of the 46-listed nations. <https://www.medicaltourism.com/mti/home https://www.medicaltourism.com/mti/home>

dudul 4y ago

It's the same in the US. All hospitals have an obligation to provide care. Source: my wife is a nurse and it happens all the time.