4 ms·

> the three of us live in the San Francisco Bay Area, and Steve and I each have three kids; we knew that the dollar figure that would allow us to live without f

> the three of us live in the San Francisco Bay Area, and Steve and I each have three kids; we knew that the dollar figure that would allow us to live without financial distress – which we put at $175,000 a year Putting aside the fact that is terrible way to determine the rate of pay for anyone, let alone every single person in a company - how on earth did they come up with such a lower number for such a high cost of living area?

jchonphoenix 4y ago
I'm curious how they make this work in sf unless they own a home or bought a long while back.
- jppope 4y ago
  they're all industry vets... its not a "college dropouts in an apartment" startup.
- reducesuffering 4y ago
  You can rent many middle class homes (4b/2b 1.7k sqft) within a 30 min. commute of their office for $3.5k - $4.5k a month. That salary after tax is $10.5k per month. That's without a partner/spouse working.
- ramesh31 4y ago
  >I'm curious how they make this work in sf unless they own a home or bought a long while back. Comment shows how warped our expectations really are. It's still a 90th percentile household income in the SFBA: https://www.vitalsigns.mtc.ca.gov/income https://www.vitalsigns.mtc.ca.gov/income
- seattle_spring 4y ago
  It’s so, so fascinating how distorted some folks’ views on money are on HN. There’s also a guy who pops in threads like this and insists that $250k in the Bay Area is “basically poverty.” It only becomes difficult to live on if you insist on private schooling, full-time daycare, BMW-level cars with private parking, etc.
  - bcrosby95 4y ago
    I don't think 250k in the bay area is poverty. But anything under 200k, if you have kids - while not being a struggle - is definitely in "1 vacation per year, never eat out, and watch your budget like a hawk" territory.
- pclmulqdq 4y ago
  They're all doing fine. I would assume all three of them have an 8-figure net worth given how long they have been in the industry.
deleted 4y ago
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alfalfasprout 4y ago
Yeah... $190k sounds a lot except in any HCOL area (SF, NY, LA, Seattle, heck even Portland has skyrocketed) it's going to feel very tight with three kids.
- nebula8804 4y ago
  190 isn't enough for LA? I was thinking of moving there while making ~120k. Granted I have no kids or anything but I thought 120k could make it in LA?
  - zamnos 4y ago
    Plenty of people do. $190k's just this ridiculous "from first principles" logic game on how much money you need to "survive" there, but it really means "not panic over money or going hungry and bank a little in an emergency fund and a retirement account" level of living, and not "If I eat ramen for a week I can afford the concert ticket" level of subsistence.
    - nebula8804 4y ago
      But is 120k at least somewhat comfortable for a single person? These different levels you described really hit different as you age. Yeah I could be ramen level but if the option is to not be ramen level at 120k elsewhere then moving to LA is not worth it but if there is a minimum level of comfort then other things make it worth making the move.
      - zamnos 4y ago
        LA and the surrounding area isn't cheap to live in. It really all depends on what you do with your money and how lavishly you want to live but I'd say $120k is actually quite reasonable if you're able to live reasonably. Given the choice of $120k in LA or $120k elsewhere, I'm not going to lie, the $120k is going to go further elsewhere (except for, like, SF or New York), but then you're not in LA. I also don't mean to impugn ramen either, as LA's got some really really good ramen restaurants. It all comes down to if you want to or not. LA's got a lot to offer but it's not for everybody.

jchonphoenix 4y ago

I'm curious how they make this work in sf unless they own a home or bought a long while back.

jppope 4y ago
they're all industry vets... its not a "college dropouts in an apartment" startup.
reducesuffering 4y ago
You can rent many middle class homes (4b/2b 1.7k sqft) within a 30 min. commute of their office for $3.5k - $4.5k a month. That salary after tax is $10.5k per month. That's without a partner/spouse working.
ramesh31 4y ago
>I'm curious how they make this work in sf unless they own a home or bought a long while back. Comment shows how warped our expectations really are. It's still a 90th percentile household income in the SFBA: https://www.vitalsigns.mtc.ca.gov/income https://www.vitalsigns.mtc.ca.gov/income
seattle_spring 4y ago
It’s so, so fascinating how distorted some folks’ views on money are on HN. There’s also a guy who pops in threads like this and insists that $250k in the Bay Area is “basically poverty.” It only becomes difficult to live on if you insist on private schooling, full-time daycare, BMW-level cars with private parking, etc.
- bcrosby95 4y ago
  I don't think 250k in the bay area is poverty. But anything under 200k, if you have kids - while not being a struggle - is definitely in "1 vacation per year, never eat out, and watch your budget like a hawk" territory.
pclmulqdq 4y ago
They're all doing fine. I would assume all three of them have an 8-figure net worth given how long they have been in the industry.

deleted 4y ago

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alfalfasprout 4y ago

Yeah... $190k sounds a lot except in any HCOL area (SF, NY, LA, Seattle, heck even Portland has skyrocketed) it's going to feel very tight with three kids.

nebula8804 4y ago
190 isn't enough for LA? I was thinking of moving there while making ~120k. Granted I have no kids or anything but I thought 120k could make it in LA?
- zamnos 4y ago
  Plenty of people do. $190k's just this ridiculous "from first principles" logic game on how much money you need to "survive" there, but it really means "not panic over money or going hungry and bank a little in an emergency fund and a retirement account" level of living, and not "If I eat ramen for a week I can afford the concert ticket" level of subsistence.
  - nebula8804 4y ago
    But is 120k at least somewhat comfortable for a single person? These different levels you described really hit different as you age. Yeah I could be ramen level but if the option is to not be ramen level at 120k elsewhere then moving to LA is not worth it but if there is a minimum level of comfort then other things make it worth making the move.
    - zamnos 4y ago
      LA and the surrounding area isn't cheap to live in. It really all depends on what you do with your money and how lavishly you want to live but I'd say $120k is actually quite reasonable if you're able to live reasonably. Given the choice of $120k in LA or $120k elsewhere, I'm not going to lie, the $120k is going to go further elsewhere (except for, like, SF or New York), but then you're not in LA. I also don't mean to impugn ramen either, as LA's got some really really good ramen restaurants. It all comes down to if you want to or not. LA's got a lot to offer but it's not for everybody.