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GH is a special case. They're darlings of the tech community, and they throw a ton of events. Even if they were crappy to work for they would probably have an

by phillmv 15y ago

GH is a special case. They're darlings of the tech community, and they throw a ton of events. Even if they were crappy to work for they would probably have an easy time hiring. THAT SAID, "finishing the internal CRM system" is a problem that happens in organizations an order of magnitude larger, methinks. My finishing platitude is, how did you hire - and why do you retain - engineers that don't give a shit about the project they're working on? Also, why is your PM screaming? A project meeting deadlines is his or her responsibility. Sounds like you have a crap PM to boot.

shadowfiend 15y ago
Cause and effect? I mean, yes, they're darlings of the tech community and throw a ton of events, but that is explicitly mentioned as part of their strategy for keeping their employees happy, which is the underlying principle for their “scaling”. So perhaps it's a self-reinforcing cycle: they were originally darlings because of their service, and as they've grown, their attempts to keep their employees happy result in more goodwill, which further makes them darlings. In essence, I think if they were crappy to work for, they wouldn't have an easy time hiring, because a lot of the cool stuff they do just wouldn't happen.
- phillmv 15y ago
  Oh, I'm really, really open to that interpretation. I'm currently unemployed by choice and what they describe is basically a dream job, imho.
spitfire 15y ago
I'm not a fan of loudmouth hipster programmers either. But it's easy to see how a programmer was hired and came to work on a project he didn't like. He was hired to work on a project he was interested in, and was moved over to a project he dreads. They won't stay long though. Which is the difference GH has from many other places: The work is interesting (to many). Therefor they have an easy time hiring and retaining good employees.
- phillmv 15y ago
  >I'm not a fan of loudmouth hipster programmers either. I throwing hipster around is a waste of time, especially considering these are extremely successful hipster programmers. Create product everyone loves, create environment everyone loves to work in, live in San Francisco: fucking hipsters. >He was hired to work on a project he was interested in, and was moved over to a project he dreads. They won't stay long though. There is always shit work to do. It's a constant of the universe - there will always be work you're not super interested in. The difference is, is the rest of your job good enough to suck it up and take one for the team? (Do you even think of it in terms of taking one for the team, or do you think you are just being shat upon?)
sbov 15y ago
I work on several projects that I have never used. However, my employer doesn't completely shield me from people who do use it. At least for me, the satisfaction comes from interacting with people who the project helps and seeing how it helps them. I think part of why (some)? engineers may not give a shit about the project they're working on isn't necessarily because they have no interest in it, but because they haven't met anyone with an interest in it. In github's case, it just happens to be themselves. I like to know what I'm doing actually matters. Meeting people my stuff impacts helps with that.
- jdunck 15y ago
  My best experiences in corporate IT were when I escaped the department for short times - a flight to an office whose processes were on fire, a deployment of a new warehouse management system where all the workers were counting on me, a 3-month 5-person project sprint to deliver a late, overbudget project without adult supervision. Whatever the purpose of IT middle management, it does not appear to accomplish much.
- wladimir 15y ago
  I like to know what I'm doing actually matters I wish I could give you ten upvotes. I get a lot out of interacting with the people that actually use my software. It makes things more personal and that makes me more motivated to work on a project. And the feedback helps to make what they actually want instead of having to second-guess, or build to some abstract specs. That the project is technically interesting/challenging also goes a long way, of course, but that's not everything. Worst would be a project that is boring and you don't know whether anyone, including yourself, is ever going to use it.

by phillmv 15y ago

shadowfiend 15y ago

Cause and effect? I mean, yes, they're darlings of the tech community and throw a ton of events, but that is explicitly mentioned as part of their strategy for keeping their employees happy, which is the underlying principle for their “scaling”. So perhaps it's a self-reinforcing cycle: they were originally darlings because of their service, and as they've grown, their attempts to keep their employees happy result in more goodwill, which further makes them darlings. In essence, I think if they were crappy to work for, they wouldn't have an easy time hiring, because a lot of the cool stuff they do just wouldn't happen.

phillmv 15y ago
Oh, I'm really, really open to that interpretation. I'm currently unemployed by choice and what they describe is basically a dream job, imho.

spitfire 15y ago

I'm not a fan of loudmouth hipster programmers either. But it's easy to see how a programmer was hired and came to work on a project he didn't like. He was hired to work on a project he was interested in, and was moved over to a project he dreads. They won't stay long though. Which is the difference GH has from many other places: The work is interesting (to many). Therefor they have an easy time hiring and retaining good employees.

phillmv 15y ago
>I'm not a fan of loudmouth hipster programmers either. I throwing hipster around is a waste of time, especially considering these are extremely successful hipster programmers. Create product everyone loves, create environment everyone loves to work in, live in San Francisco: fucking hipsters. >He was hired to work on a project he was interested in, and was moved over to a project he dreads. They won't stay long though. There is always shit work to do. It's a constant of the universe - there will always be work you're not super interested in. The difference is, is the rest of your job good enough to suck it up and take one for the team? (Do you even think of it in terms of taking one for the team, or do you think you are just being shat upon?)

sbov 15y ago

I work on several projects that I have never used. However, my employer doesn't completely shield me from people who do use it. At least for me, the satisfaction comes from interacting with people who the project helps and seeing how it helps them. I think part of why (some)? engineers may not give a shit about the project they're working on isn't necessarily because they have no interest in it, but because they haven't met anyone with an interest in it. In github's case, it just happens to be themselves. I like to know what I'm doing actually matters. Meeting people my stuff impacts helps with that.

jdunck 15y ago
My best experiences in corporate IT were when I escaped the department for short times - a flight to an office whose processes were on fire, a deployment of a new warehouse management system where all the workers were counting on me, a 3-month 5-person project sprint to deliver a late, overbudget project without adult supervision. Whatever the purpose of IT middle management, it does not appear to accomplish much.
wladimir 15y ago
I like to know what I'm doing actually matters I wish I could give you ten upvotes. I get a lot out of interacting with the people that actually use my software. It makes things more personal and that makes me more motivated to work on a project. And the feedback helps to make what they actually want instead of having to second-guess, or build to some abstract specs. That the project is technically interesting/challenging also goes a long way, of course, but that's not everything. Worst would be a project that is boring and you don't know whether anyone, including yourself, is ever going to use it.